SCH Vs. BLM
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SCH vs. BLM
Parsing against that blm does not count. period.
what zone did you do and what mobs did they nuke on and hat mobs did you nuke on?
i need more info other then this manuscript It was just an NW run. Nothing special but I saw I left my parser up so I decided I'd take a screenshot of it.
The average Thunder IV for both of us went down because we were killing Kaiser Behemoth and it resists Thunder. why would you nuke thunder on KaiserB?
But you definately smoked that blms damage Enternius said: It was just an NW run. . Which imply you sux because you need 3 players for NW. Keep on going. If -at least- you would try to duo it, but no lol, going in easy mode. Should get a full party for sure, I mean we never know :d Also 86K damage total ? With 3 players ? What the *** ? Pluto : 10K Cyno : 15K KB : 15K Koprinz Behe x 3 : 7K * 3 = 21K Gorynich x5 : 25K We're already at 86K. (and that's supposing you never overkilled anything) Missing Ghost / Buffalo / Bugards... Even if we add up DoTs damage, still stuff missing here. I'm dealing more solo... My average run being : F1 : 3 Ghosts : 25K + Pluto : 10K = 35K F2 : 2 Buffalo : 18K F3 : 3 Bugard : 15K F4 : 5 Gorynich : 25K + Cyno : 15K F5 : 3 Koprinz Behe : 21K (cannot attempt KB unless lucky on ghost and skipping pluto). Hey look, that's 130K damage... Even -if- I'm lucky with ghosts and get vortex on first try (-17K), same on 2nd floor (-9K), I'm still dealing more. That's how you measure efficiency and not with a parser. Enternius said: Uematsu said: Hmm one thing i noticed is the blm had drained 125, with 2 casts. This implys this blm is horendous, im talking wow horendous. It implies she had full, or close to full HP for both drains. Way to go, genius. Forgot that lol part, your blm wasn't forcing yellow ? Cause seriously unless he was draining right after resting there's no reason for not recovering more HP. And if he wasn't forcing yellow, then it's a subpar blm. lolololololololololol this ***is still going?
Pro tip: Ent = most fail player on Siren. Sub tip: Ent makes random ***up to suit his point. Ex: The ranger guide on wiki. Never going to let you live that down :) Hasso giving Ranged Acc. lol hahahahahahahahaha.
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Having both SCH and BLM to 75, I'd say that for most NM's, if ls didnt need a healer, I'd go blm. It's just easier to nuke/kite somthing without using a stratagem every minute.
To be honest I'd say that SCH and BLM are equal in certain respects, SCH may have the 20% from Ebullience, yet BLM has +32 MAB from MABIV (And no there would never be a situation where I sub sch to blm or blm to sch, don't have a good reason to.) While sch has access to weather and stratagems on top of all their other JAs, they're limited in the recast of stratagems. As every sch knows once your charges run out your DMG is rediculously gimped, and you're stuck waiting for next charge. SCH also has access to helices, which can help out a ton on longer, more drawn out fights. I think I've gotten a max of 200~ and that every 10 seconds isn't bad. I also would just like to point out that gear sets like enfeebling skill and Resist down are easier to achieve on BLM. Maybe someday SE will come out with SCH JSE :( Enternius said: 3. Even capped Thunder Potency will only put you at +12 MAB, and then +8 more base MAB than a SCH, giving 20 total MAB that SCH doesn't have, whereas Ebullience gives the equivalent of anywhere from 30-40 MAB depending on your gear. Ok, I read this and went LOL. A) 5/5 Thunder Potency (each merit gives 2% potency) would mean that BLMs have an innate potency on Thunder Spells of 10% EXTRA 100% of the time. Go 5/5 Thunder and Blizzard and boom, you are 10% 100% of the time instead of 20% every minute. B) You mentioned that BLM gets 2 INT more than SCH, but you get 7 INT with weather. Ok, so that gives you 5 more INT with Blizzard only. Hmm, what would happen if you fight undead or strong resist Blizzard? Or something that absorbs Blizzard? All of the sudden, you are stuck with either having Hailstorm, but no obi nor weather bonus (since thats the only reason you are able to nuke even close to BLM level) or using another spell, but no INT+7. Kindof stuck there, aren't ya? C) Having an obi on does NOT increase your MAcc. All obis do is increase POTENCY. You still have to worry about hitting it for full damage first. So, if you try to get close to capped MAcc, you are losing a lot of MAB and INT gear. Quote: 4. And an SCH's Thunder IV can even compare to an average BLM's Burst II. Yeah, I have never seen a SCH's T4 do more than 1600 damage. My Burst II on an offday can do 2000 damage roughly. Thats without the MCrit+ from Witch's Sash. How does that compare? MP/time? That problem is solved with BLM/SCH. Korpg said: B) You mentioned that BLM gets 2 INT more than SCH, but you get 7 INT with weather. Ok, so that gives you 5 more INT with Blizzard only. Hmm, what would happen if you fight undead or strong resist Blizzard? Or something that absorbs Blizzard? All of the sudden, you are stuck with either having Hailstorm, but no obi nor weather bonus (since thats the only reason you are able to nuke even close to BLM level) or using another spell, but no INT+7. Kindof stuck there, aren't ya? B.) I think he means with Stormsurge, thats +7INT regardless of spell. Guys, stop arguing. The OP made their choice. You're all just looking bad now (except Uematsu, who couldn't have looked more HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE).
Enternius said: As we speak, my INT without food in my crappy nuking gear is 72+43, or 115, and my Elemental Skill with minimal merits (Seriously, 2 merits or 4 skill) is 302. Once I cap my INT (3 more) and Elemental skill (12 more), I'll only be 2 INT and 6 Elemental skill away from the ideal 120/320. And my gear really isn't even good yet. SS your gear, or I won't believe it. If you can't even take a picture of your TV Screen with your Gears and total INT up, then you can't prove your point in anything. oh wait, you can take a SS of your gear: Enternius said:  From a Limbus run we just did today. Demetria is a BLM, I'm on SCH, and Cyprian is the RDM. Highest Freeze is only 1296? Either say what you were fighting, or the gear of that BLM. If it was NW Apollyon, then....wtf. I need to SS my damage from NW Apollyon and show to you what a true BLM can do. 1750+ Burst II on Ghosts/Buffalo/Buggards/Wyverns. 1200 Freeze II on Kaiser Behemoth. Seriously, can you honestly beat that damage? http://www.ffxiah.com/item_sets.php?id=107178 easy 320/120 setup for taru with full merits and cream puff
http://www.ffxiah.com/item_sets.php?id=107181 pure dmg set http://www.ffxiah.com/item_sets.php?id=107183 Int setup for helix http://www.ffxiah.com/item_sets.php?id=55151 300+ enfeebling set Nothing in these setups is impossible to get and can hold it's own(or surpass) Blm's nuking Aaroca said: B.) I think he means with Stormsurge, thats +7INT regardless of spell. Yeah, but the only way a SCH can even compare damage with BLM is to have a sea obi, which increases spelldamage by 10% damage ONLY with weather. Meaning that with Hailstorm and Stormsurge, a SCH can have 10% Damage increase on spells and +7 INT. On a mob that superresists Blizzard, and a SCH casts a spell that is not Blizzard BUT has Hailstorm on, all the SCH gets is +7 INT and a dead obi (or uses another belt). There is no increase in damage outside the +7 INT the spell will get, but its not anywhere near the damage increase an obi provides. Case in point: A SCH's normal Blizzard IV without hailstorm would do 1000 damage. With Hailstorm and Stormsurge, it "could" do 1050 damage. With Hailstorm, Stormsurge, and Hyorin Obi, it "could" do 1155 damage. Just the obi itself adds 100 (105) damage. INT+7 "could" add 50 damage. I say could because I don't want to figure it out with the formulas. I'm pretty sure that INT+7 with a T4 spell adds about 50 damage or so. Bikpik said: http://www.ffxiah.com/item_sets.php?id=107178 easy 320/120 setup for taru with full merits and cream puff http://www.ffxiah.com/item_sets.php?id=107181 pure dmg set http://www.ffxiah.com/item_sets.php?id=107183 Int setup for helix http://www.ffxiah.com/item_sets.php?id=55151 300+ enfeebling set Nothing in these setups is impossible to get and can hold it's own(or surpass) Blm's nuking Heres the thing your 320/120 only gets to 120 with some either merits storm surge on top of your food and you have 0 MAB. I can get around 320/120 while wearing over 20MAB no food no merits or storm surge. And your pure dmg set puts your macc lower than my blm nekkid so good lucky landing stuff. But sure those sets could beat bad blms. And youll easily beat them on enfeebling unless they /sch Korpg said: Highest Freeze is only 1296? Either say what you were fighting, or the gear of that BLM. If it was NW Apollyon, then....wtf. I need to SS my damage from NW Apollyon and show to you what a true BLM can do. 1750+ Burst II on Ghosts/Buffalo/Buggards/Wyverns. 1200 Freeze II on Kaiser Behemoth. Seriously, can you honestly beat that damage? That BLM was gimp lol :< My Thunder IV alone is doing 1530 on Cynoprosopi... 1575 on Koprinz Behemoth. Reaching 2K+ with Freeze II on Buffalo, etc. Korpg said: Korpg said: Here is the honest facts. BLM's pros: Higher damaged nukes (BLM T4 compared to a SCH T4 with that 20% potency stratagem on). Access to AMIIs Access to Blind/Bind/SleepII/Sleepga/SleepgaII without subjobs or JAs. Access to the 6 Elemental debuffs without subjobs to worry about it. Access to stronger gear based on INT and nuking (i.e. Macc+, MAB, INT+) SCH's pros: Ability to go from DD to healer in an instant Access to debuff -ga spells Access to buff -ga spells Access to weather effects (i.e. full time obis) Access to weather debuffs Stratagems and Sublimation. Now, you can absorb the pros of one job into another job, but out of the two, BLM absorbs the most pros. For Example, take the bolded statements of this quote: Enternius said: Well let's take it this way. Pros BLM vs. SCH. BLM: -AMII spells. -Um... -Hm... SCH: -Guaranteed -10% MP cost and cast time through Dark Arts -Guaranteed additional 10% potency from weather Spell+Obi -Guaranteed additional 10% potency AND 7 INT from hailstorm+Hyorin Obi -JA that gives +20% potency every 1 minute -JA that gives -50% MP cost every 1 minute -JA that gives -50% cast time and recast every 1 minute -JA that makes spells like Gravity, Sleep, Bind, Paralyze etc AoE, every 1 minute -Access to damn near all WHM spells, making the /RDM vs. /WHM debate completely moot -One of the best sets of both Artifact and Relic armor in the game -Reraise II...Come on... -Sublimation? It's better than Refresh. Ok, some of the bolded statements are a weaker version (i.e. only 2 charges on Stratagems instead of 4, so the timer would be once ever 2 minutes, and RR 1 instead of RR 2) but you got to admit, some of the pros outlined can be absorbed by a BLM/SCH. BLM/SCH is the best nuker. There is no questions asked, because its got the major pros of a SCH added into the major pros of a BLM. The only problem about a BLM/SCH is that there is no SS/Blink anymore. That can be remedied by a SCH/RDM in the party, who's job is to SS-ga the BLMs every now and then. So, to answer your question, a BLM is better than a SCH if used right. If you are going pure damage, BLM/Any. If you are going pure Damage/MP, BLM/SCH. If you are going by usefulness, SCH/Any. Thats it. Bumping this because its a good point and people don't tend to read pages outside of current ones. cant get any clearer than this, great points korpg Antipika said: Korpg said: Highest Freeze is only 1296? Either say what you were fighting, or the gear of that BLM. If it was NW Apollyon, then....wtf. I need to SS my damage from NW Apollyon and show to you what a true BLM can do. 1750+ Burst II on Ghosts/Buffalo/Buggards/Wyverns. 1200 Freeze II on Kaiser Behemoth. Seriously, can you honestly beat that damage? That BLM was gimp lol :< My Thunder IV alone is doing 1530 on Cynoprosopi... 1575 on Koprinz Behemoth. Reaching 2K+ with Freeze II on Buffalo, etc. OMG look at this blm can nuke harder than blm!!! Clearly blm can't nuke as good as blm!    Bikpik said: http://www.ffxiah.com/item_sets.php?id=107178 easy 320/120 setup for taru with full merits and cream puff http://www.ffxiah.com/item_sets.php?id=107181 pure dmg set http://www.ffxiah.com/item_sets.php?id=107183 Int setup for helix http://www.ffxiah.com/item_sets.php?id=55151 300+ enfeebling set Nothing in these setups is impossible to get and can hold it's own(or surpass) Blm's nuking The bolded set is probably pretty good on Blizzard spells, but you'll loose your 320/120 set when you have to nuke with a different element. Not to mention compared to a blm 320/120 set you're lacking a ton of magic attack, and I realize Sch is about nuking more efficient not more powerful but I felt the difference to be important enough to bring up. Sometimes all you care about is nuking the hardest you can, and then resting your mp. When you're asked to magic burst on a high resistant NM is a good example. Also the fact that your 320/120 set requires that you are a taru is a big limiting factor. I'm an Elvaan BLM and can still obtain a respectable 320/120 set without having to merit int. This would not be the case for Sch. I'm sure having access to a 320/120 set on 5/5 races vs. 1/5 is a welcomed prospect to any would-be mage. This is my CURRENT set, not my ideal set for nuking.
 Yes, I do have a Elemental Torque JUST for HNMs. With the elemental Torque, I have 120/321 WITHOUT FOOD. I'm sure Davsa's set is much closer to my idea though, but still. I'm way away from being perfect, and I'm still managed to geto 120/321 as a hume. Thats right, as a HUME. Korpg said: This is my CURRENT set, not my ideal set for nuking. Yes, I do have a Elemental Torque JUST for HNMs. With the elemental Torque, I have 120/321 WITHOUT FOOD. I'm sure Davsa's set is much closer to my idea though, but still. I'm way away from being perfect, and I'm still managed to geto 120/321 as a hume. Thats right, as a HUME. Unfortunatly I don't have some of that stuff or even acess to it with the stuff I currently do. Effectively I have the same thing but I use demon helm+1 no augments on weskit. Snow ring instead of omega. Prism cape. Magnetic earring instead of phantom. That puts me at like 299/126 no food I think. So I put in af gloves for HNMs or in those tinnin SSs dont even bother and get close enough. Yeah my gear could use some improvement and I still can double and triple other blms dmg consistently Dasva said: Unfortunatly I don't have some of that stuff or even acess to it with the stuff I currently do. Effectively I have the same thing but I use demon helm+1 no augments on weskit. Snow ring instead of omega. Prism cape. Magnetic earring instead of phantom. That puts me at like 299/126 no food I think. So I put in af gloves for HNMs or in those tinnin SSs dont even bother and get close enough. Yeah my gear could use some improvement and I still can double and triple other blms dmg consistently AMK Cap is easy to get, mine has INT+6, Fast Cast+2, MAcc+2. Weskit takes some gil to get the right auguments for. Don't know why you would use Snow instead of Omega, since you get more MAcc (which is BLM's bane for bigger ***) and only lose 2 INT out of the deal, even though its still 2 INT. I still have a Snow Ring JUST for enfeebles though, I replace it with Sorc Ring. Get Ixion Cape. Enmity - saves. Whats the stats on Magnetic again? I don't think it has any INT+ on it, or I would have gotten it instead of Ethreal Earring. And when you put on AF gloves, you lose MAB+5. My MAB is +28 (I fulltime Sorc ring) and +36 at 50% MP or less. Whats your MAB then? Dasva said: Unfortunatly I don't have some of that stuff or even acess to it with the stuff I currently do. Effectively I have the same thing but I use demon helm+1 no augments on weskit. Snow ring instead of omega. Prism cape. Magnetic earring instead of phantom. That puts me at like 299/126 no food I think. So I put in af gloves for HNMs or in those tinnin SSs dont even bother and get close enough. Yeah my gear could use some improvement and I still can double and triple other blms dmg consistently Not to troll, but I'd use Phantom earring over Magnetic, nuke-wise that is. Here's my current nuke setup: I just got selenian cap yesterday though, MAB and INT augments. Also swap in Vicious mufflers or Sorc. Tonban. http://www.ffxiah.com/item_sets.php?id=106662 Korpg said: AMK Cap is easy to get, mine has INT+6, Fast Cast+2, MAcc+2. Weskit takes some gil to get the right auguments for. Don't know why you would use Snow instead of Omega, since you get more MAcc (which is BLM's bane for bigger ***) and only lose 2 INT out of the deal, even though its still 2 INT. I still have a Snow Ring JUST for enfeebles though, I replace it with Sorc Ring. Get Ixion Cape. Enmity - saves. Whats the stats on Magnetic again? I don't think it has any INT+ on it, or I would have gotten it instead of Ethreal Earring. And when you put on AF gloves, you lose MAB+5. My MAB is +28 (I fulltime Sorc ring) and +36 at 50% MP or less. Whats your MAB then? Like I said I can't get some stuff like you got. I don't have acess to aslan and Ixion cost alot. I don't do eijwhatever. And I haven't really done any of the MKE missions. And I use magnetic because 1int is really not gonna do a whole while the conserve mp and -spell interrupt rate is rather nice and since my resting maccro already doesn't have room for all my hmp gear its nice to just have that in there. Also the 20mp isn't bad. Now if I had novio that'd be another story. Or hell even just had a 2MAB earring. And before my af gloves I have same MAB as you Dasva said: Unfortunatly I don't have some of that stuff or even acess to it with the stuff I currently do. Effectively I have the same thing but I use demon helm+1 no augments on weskit. Snow ring instead of omega. Prism cape. Magnetic earring instead of phantom. That puts me at like 299/126 no food I think. So I put in af gloves for HNMs or in those tinnin SSs dont even bother and get close enough. Yeah my gear could use some improvement and I still can double and triple other blms dmg consistently I actually wasn't counting using aquillos staff. So my nuke set has more like so my normal nuke set on ice spells is more like 309/123 no food I think. So really af gloves is a little overkill at that point. I'd kill for an aureole Vincevalentine said: Hey look, the OP's levelling SCH. Way to go BLM's! I totally saw that coming. Actually, to be fair, I have decided to level both in 5 level increments. It will obviously take longer this way to reach 75, but it's not like I'm hurting for jobs or invites to events as it is. In the end, I feel that SCH fits my playstyle better, but I also can't get past the fact that it does nothing for my Maat's Cap goal. Someone on one of the first pages pointed out that I probably have lots of time considering that I have six 75s, and that was probably the truest statement in all the posts. Time is definitely on my side as I have been caring for two sick parents for the last year and not working. The main reason I've steered clear of BLM to this point is that I've seen countless players get it to 75 and then never get to play anything else again. I've been in quite a few linkshells that force you to come BLM no matter what if you have it leveled. Hopefully, with all the jobs I do have leveled, that won't be the case for me but I guess only time will tell. SCH Is the best choice :D
But since your leveling both I guess you can decide that on your own. :) My experience with BLM and SCH @ 75, Scholar in my opinion is much more fun. Its a more diverse job. But Happy leveling and GL. Out of all the SCHs who responded to this, they haven't said why SCH is a smart choice, except for a small few.
They said that its because of main heal or MP per nuke choice, but you know what, if thats all a SCH is, why level it? WHM is a better healer, RDM is a better Buffer/Debuffer, BLM is a better nuker. What does SCH have that blows any/all 3 of them out of the water? SCH would PWN RDM & WHM & BLM Out of the water if it had Haste.
In certain situations its better. If your playing a job to enjoy it i say SCH. Its more fun and your capable of doing more things, like debuffing, buffing, nuking, healing. BLM Can just NUKE. Sure BLM does a bit more DMG with spells, but with Ebbulience and Parsimony that is greater then the blm's 'little more' dmg. Besides that, you can debuff the mob and buff you for instance if your fighting Puddings, you have erase, to get rid of bio and choke and whatnot. Plus you can cast Shell IV AND you can change the WEATHER to make your spells do more. BLMs are just angry cause there is competition out there. For someone who has leveled both BLM and SCH, SCH > BLM.
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