Pandemonium Warden Was Just Killed By Apathy Of Remora

You log off at 75%, 50%, and 25% to avoid the massive Astral Flows from 9 Avatars. I for one see nothing wrong with logging out at all because you have a few choices here as far as I can see with absolutely zero PW experience myself...
#1: Stun every avatar as well as PW at 75% IF they can even be stunned.
#2: You run so far out of range that you're not hit by the AF's (Provided it doesn't have Draw-In which as far as I know it doesn't. And I'm not clear where exactly he summons the avatars to AF. I know everyone with hate gets hit whether in the Alliance or not.. But not the radius of AF or how he targets/centers.)
#3: You ALL die to AF and then Reraise up and 'try' to stay alive while everyone's weakness wears off. Which didn't they do some of that with a lot of blu's spamming buffs/reraise/cannonball at one point? O.oa

Anyway... Of those three.. I'd probably choose to have the majority log out and then log back in to avoid potential EXP loss as well as time lost from weakness.

Now all of you that are complaining and saying they're not the best b/c they took down something you couldn't, stfu.

And btw... Congratulations Apathy. =)

GO US!

But the fact that you have to do something like that is just ridiculous on SE's part. It still doesn't make it a legit kill, point blank.

grats guys, someone used thier heads, think outside the box right

Now that I really think about it. It's not too farfetched to log out as a method of avoiding what would most likely be certain doom / wipe. After all it's a common tactic used for when someone accidently calls for help, or someone gets way too much enmity for their own good, etc. As far as i'm concerned as long as hacks or whacky glitches weren't (remember the AV wall trick?) used to exploit and defeat it, I call it legit.

Although all together we shouldn't have to resort to such tactics is what I'm talking about, bad on SE's development.

It may be the only way, but it's still not legit reguardless. (atleast in my eyes)

Seems like it's back to the drawing board for SE to create another "undefeatable NM" XD

I have a feeling there's a more direct and intended way to kill it but certainly more than one way aside from that to defeat it. I'm sure if SE saw this battle they'd say something along the lines of: "Oh, well, I guess you could do that too..."

I have faith they'll make another NM with obscure or arcane methods of defeating really tough NM bosses. I mean, I wonder how many Odin runs it took to figure out that kneeling before his monologue 2hr would spare your life?

This is true. I wonder if they did see people logging as a means of escaping the Astral flow or not ... either way you can guarentee the big boss in the next expansion pack they release will have that covered lol

I also wonder if the developers sat down with thier perfect party setup and managed to defeat it with a more conventional means O.o well the challenge is out there for people who don't want to do the logout tactic to prove themselves =D I so want to run a ZNM shell to beat this guy

Couldn't believe it myself when I heard this saturday night. Congrats, Apathy!


Absolute Virtue still remains undefeatable by conventional means. Honestly though, it just sounds like you need two or three top-notch alliances to hold him down.

SE needs to be more blunt with their hints too, because the one they gave us practically said nothing.

I rly don´t get you guys.

only a few agree with me, that this win means nothing. it happend through cheating. this win did never happen in my opinion.

I mean...
is this the american way of life?!

You march into a poor country and blow away rusty buckets with an abrahms tank and you are proud of your win.
you survive PW by logging and and you are proud of your win.

this win is a shame nothing more

Considering neither of us have actually fought it before. We really have no true say in what is right or wrong. For all we know, and I'm merely assuming; they logged out to avoid which would certainly be an unavoidable doom/wipe with it's 9 avatar astral flow.

GTFO Moron.

This isn't an American only game!

How do you know that it's not supposed to be killed by logging out? The two hour time limit doesn't exactly provide a cushion of time to withstand the constant Astral Flows, somehow kite or hold it whilst everyone unweakens.

Nine astral flows, did I read correctly? So that's about six minutes per Astral Flow to unweaken, so an hour of the two hours is spent unweakening. Even if there's not nine, just take into account the ~six minutes for an alliance to unweaken per Astral Flow that they decide to "heroically" and "unshamefully" take to the face.

Heroic? More like stupid.

Anyway, do the maths, and when it's been killed fifty times without logging out, feel free to come back and QQ that they cheated about it.



A shame? Hardly. Every linkshell across every server now has a rough idea of how to win this themselves, if they didn't already. People will also talk about how "That Apathy of Remora" were the first shell to defeat Pandemonium Warden.

A shame? Hardly...



LOL, you're too much.

Lol :) you got a misunderstanding. 9 AF is in 1 time, all 9 avatars are there to blow you away :)

O_O

That must hurt, chances of Shadow Ring proc'ing nine consecutive times? Uh...

1/4 uh... Nonagoned? <.<

Well anyway, I'm sure that nobody would survive that, so that's an instant ~six minutes waiting to unweaken. Point still stands! :p

Until SE comes outs and says that PW wasn't supposed to be killed this way, then it's a legit kill. Nobody here works for SE so there's no way for anybody to know that this wasn't the way they intended, was can speculate that it's not the correct way, but we can't know 100% until SE tells us.

And besides, getting to final form with enough time to log out to avoid AF is pretty damn impressive imo.

How many forms exactly did it go through? (I'm not in any ZNM LS or anything like that, I doubt I'll ever bother going after T4 ZNM's, let alone PW.. I just like knowing stuff like this >.>)

Did SE lower PW's HP or something? Just thinking about the BTL fight that took 18hr and got a lot of media attention. Please, correct me if I'm wrong, but they went through 20(ish) forms in 18 hours? Just curious to know what sort of adjustment SE made to this in that update.

But yeah, congratulations on the win. Even if it wasn't meant to be done by logging, you came up with a quick solution to a problem, deserves at least a pat on the back =P

For FFXIah.com this the only one ive seen.

Your welcome!

Forms, not forums.

Yeah, they lowered the HP of both PW and AV and limited them to 2 hour fights in an update following BTLs 18 hour fight which prompted the mass zergings of AV until he was patched to gain a resistance to souleater damage.

I'll repeat myself from the first page:

If all you can do is complain about the way they won, go find us a better method or put the foot back in your mouth.

The whole logging thing is an exploit.
It was a victory from an exploit.
Personally, I cannot congratulate that.

I wish i kissed as much *** as certain people in this thread

Congrats to Apathy for doing this, exploit or not, this is an awsome acomplishment.

Haseyo do you seriously need to come back and say the same damn thing every time you come on?
Everybody got your point, you cant congratulate it, go back in your hole.

Appearently not, seeing others are repeating as well. (or just not reading at all)

Sorry, but logging out of ffxi is not an exploit in ffxi. Hard to exploit an online game, when you aren't even logged on.

Maybe exploit wasn't the right word.
Let's try this:

You are playing a game against a huge boss.
Right before it lands a huge attack, you put in an invincibily code, then take it off after it is over.
Does that somewhat make the victory legit?

No.

But, if you found a way to negate the damage that doesn't alter game mechanics (like using an Invincibility code would do), then yes, I'd classify that as a legitimate win.

Such as the Emerald Weapon fight from FF7. How many people are likely to have killed it, without using cheats, using a full set of 20(ish) materia equipped to each character?

Taking off materia to avoid one of it's abilities isn't doing anything to a game mechanic, it's simply a method to avoid it's most powerful ability.

By logging out in FFXI, you aren't changing anything the game won't let you do, and as such, you're simply finding a solution to a problem. Whether or not it was "How SE thought it should be dealt with", I doubt anyone on here is likely to know until at least next Fanfest.

re: logging out

Its a novel approach to avoiding a mass wipe, especially since you know the intervals at which the AF will go off. Given SE's answer to the community uproar about the "18 hour fight", it somehow seems fitting that part of the method used to defeat it (this time) involved logging out of the game.

Kudos!