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フォーラム » FFXI » Servers » Phoenix » Ballista Tournament
Ballista Tournament
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 Asura.Leonlionheart
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By Asura.Leonlionheart 2011-11-20 19:05:37
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Odin.Upbeat said: »
Video I recorded earlier today showing how the NIN from the first fight in the tournament should of went about nuking:

USE AURORAL DRAPE USE AURORAL DRAPE USE AURORAL DRAPE USE AURORAL DRAPE USE AURORAL DRAPE USE AURORAL DRAPE USE AURORAL DRAPE USE AURORAL DRAPE USE AURORAL DRAPE USE AURORAL DRAPE USE AURORAL DRAPE

that blu was horrible

l2AoE
 Odin.Upbeat
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By Odin.Upbeat 2011-11-20 19:18:35
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In his defense he did kill me a few times by Diaga, Sudden Lunge, Quad/Goblin. I didn't have any PDT gear on so just that was enough to kill me. Disseverment/quad would of probably been a better choice, and would of killed me in that third fight, however to be completely honest for most of the people who show up to PvP(With me anyways) this guy wasn't bad at all.
 Phoenix.Urteil
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By Phoenix.Urteil 2011-11-23 10:59:11
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Auroral Drape is impossible to get off if the enemy is not bound or gravitied *sp
 Bismarck.Stfutaru
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By Bismarck.Stfutaru 2011-11-23 14:11:52
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Magical blue spells would've been better since it goes through shadows (but not blink), coupled with Resist Sleep trait + gear.
 Caitsith.Mahayaya
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By Caitsith.Mahayaya 2011-11-23 14:26:45
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Bismarck.Stfutaru said: »
Magical blue spells would've been better since it goes through shadows (but not blink), coupled with Resist Sleep trait + gear.

For this particular fight, /SCH sublimation and Resist Silence gear would work better. As far as being able to damage the BLU to the point of sublimation not working, NIN's only means of AoE shadow wipe is using Manifestation and BLU can start the fight with Zephyr Mantle and Magic Barrier. Zephyr is cheap to start with in case someone tries to wipe your shadows, then you can follow up later with Occultation.
 Phoenix.Urteil
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By Phoenix.Urteil 2011-11-24 04:18:38
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Caitsith.Mahayaya said: »
Bismarck.Stfutaru said: »
Magical blue spells would've been better since it goes through shadows (but not blink), coupled with Resist Sleep trait + gear.

For this particular fight, /SCH sublimation and Resist Silence gear would work better. As far as being able to damage the BLU to the point of sublimation not working, NIN's only means of AoE shadow wipe is using Manifestation and BLU can start the fight with Zephyr Mantle and Magic Barrier. Zephyr is cheap to start with in case someone tries to wipe your shadows, then you can follow up later with Occultation.

Very good points. However NIN would have two stratagems, ergo two wipes at a range.
[+]
 ninjie
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By ninjie 2011-11-24 04:57:57
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Phoenix.Urteil said: »
Caitsith.Mahayaya said: »
Bismarck.Stfutaru said: »
Magical blue spells would've been better since it goes through shadows (but not blink), coupled with Resist Sleep trait + gear.

For this particular fight, /SCH sublimation and Resist Silence gear would work better. As far as being able to damage the BLU to the point of sublimation not working, NIN's only means of AoE shadow wipe is using Manifestation and BLU can start the fight with Zephyr Mantle and Magic Barrier. Zephyr is cheap to start with in case someone tries to wipe your shadows, then you can follow up later with Occultation.

Very good points. However NIN would have two stratagems, ergo two wipes at a range.

In the amount of time it would take NIN to even get the second stratagem off, BLU should have already have Blastbomb off (assuming it doesn't resist) and be midway through Auroral Drape (assuming this doesn't resist) cast. In my honest opinion, any competent BLU has way to many tools at its disposal to actually lose to a NIN.
 ninjie
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By ninjie 2011-11-24 04:59:50
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ninjie said: »
Phoenix.Urteil said: »
Caitsith.Mahayaya said: »
Bismarck.Stfutaru said: »
Magical blue spells would've been better since it goes through shadows (but not blink), coupled with Resist Sleep trait + gear.

For this particular fight, /SCH sublimation and Resist Silence gear would work better. As far as being able to damage the BLU to the point of sublimation not working, NIN's only means of AoE shadow wipe is using Manifestation and BLU can start the fight with Zephyr Mantle and Magic Barrier. Zephyr is cheap to start with in case someone tries to wipe your shadows, then you can follow up later with Occultation.

Very good points. However NIN would have two stratagems, ergo two wipes at a range.

In the amount of time it would take NIN to even get the second stratagem off, BLU should have already have Blastbomb off (assuming it doesn't resist) and be midway through Auroral Drape (assuming this doesn't resist) cast. In my honest opinion, any competent BLU that has experience in PVP has way to many tools at its disposal to actually lose to a NIN.
 Bismarck.Stfutaru
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By Bismarck.Stfutaru 2011-11-24 08:39:22
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ninjie said: »
Phoenix.Urteil said: »
Caitsith.Mahayaya said: »
Bismarck.Stfutaru said: »

In the amount of time it would take NIN to even get the second stratagem off, BLU should have already have Blastbomb off (assuming it doesn't resist) and be midway through Auroral Drape (assuming this doesn't resist) cast. In my honest opinion, any competent BLU has way to many tools at its disposal to actually lose to a NIN.

I'd agree with /SCH, though I would still stack Resist Sleep rather than Resist Silence. /RDM offers fast cast and Convert which you can use if you have low HP and high MP and can be a game changer. Katana procs are kind of random and, I don't see silence as too big of an issue since with a decent PDT gear katana won't hurt much and you have to be in range for the ninjitsu spells in which case you can just run away. Definitely wouldn't even bother with Auroral Drape, casting range is like 7' and takes a while to cast and Regurgitation is much, much better than Blastbomb since it's a 12' range, Regurgitation is 21' range and deals around 500 damage depending on set. Regurgitation then Water Bomb (also a 21' range) and then an Everyone's Grudge (21') and he's dead, if not another Regurgitation. Major concern is the paralyze though I'd say.
[+]
 Valefor.Angeluzun
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By Valefor.Angeluzun 2011-11-24 17:34:53
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I guess this is as good a place to ask as any. I was looking through wiki for shadow wiping AoE spells in a blu's arsenal and read that whirl of rage only takes 2-3 shadow, that empty thrash only takes 1 shadow (even though its physical AoE? that doesn't make sense but w/e I havent Ballista'd in ages to confirm or deny)

So I remembered back at 75 being able to wipe shadows easy with battle dance. The talk page on wiki claims that it still wipes all shadows, strips Third Eye, and also Blink shadows.

What I'm getting at besides the obvious "shadows shouldnt even be a problem for a blu" is: does that still hold true? Does Battle Dance wipe all Utsu shadows even on a NIN with 5?
 Phoenix.Urteil
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By Phoenix.Urteil 2011-11-27 11:36:32
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Valefor.Angeluzun said: »
I guess this is as good a place to ask as any. I was looking through wiki for shadow wiping AoE spells in a blu's arsenal and read that whirl of rage only takes 2-3 shadow, that empty thrash only takes 1 shadow (even though its physical AoE? that doesn't make sense but w/e I havent Ballista'd in ages to confirm or deny)

So I remembered back at 75 being able to wipe shadows easy with battle dance. The talk page on wiki claims that it still wipes all shadows, strips Third Eye, and also Blink shadows.

What I'm getting at besides the obvious "shadows shouldnt even be a problem for a blu" is: does that still hold true? Does Battle Dance wipe all Utsu shadows even on a NIN with 5?


No, a lot of the blue spells seem to be random though I think there are ones like frypan that wipe 100% every time.
 Phoenix.Urteil
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By Phoenix.Urteil 2011-11-27 11:40:31
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Though the silence effect on Auroral Drape is rather subpar and will most likely be resisted with the ninja speed casting nukes which if you get below 50% hp, the BLU will be in trouble.

Many of the magical spells simply have too long of a casting time to be executed without proper CC on a person who knows what they are doing, and does not stand still like a complete total retard.

The fey silence Katanas/weapons/whatever are no joke and proc often and hard forcing the BLU to slot (or anyone) into resist gear rather than PDT/MDT opening them up to damage.

The nin/sch will also have aspir/drain/dispel which if the blu gets below 50%hp the ninja will be able to put severe dispel/aspir pressure gain distance and drain is not affected by saline coat + it wears quickly.
 Odin.Sawtelle
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By Odin.Sawtelle 2011-11-27 15:21:49
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question about resist traits, attempted to pvp on whm/pld today against a nin/sch. Had Flawless ribbon, insomnia earring, and pld's resist sleep2 trait and resisted every sleep (still got crushed though). Would just those 2 pieces be enough to switch to /rdm without having to worry about sleep?
 Phoenix.Urteil
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By Phoenix.Urteil 2011-11-29 05:56:28
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Odin.Sawtelle said: »
question about resist traits, attempted to pvp on whm/pld today against a nin/sch. Had Flawless ribbon, insomnia earring, and pld's resist sleep2 trait and resisted every sleep (still got crushed though). Would just those 2 pieces be enough to switch to /rdm without having to worry about sleep?

No.


The natural trait from /pld was helping you alot, since the max resist sleep attainable by PLD is III and seems to be incredibly potent and have more mileage than its higher tier counterparts.


WHM shouldn't be getting "crushed" by anything, they have good damange with empyrean/magian weapons and amazing PDT options.

Magical DPS with Holy and the ridiculous Holy II, and amazing survivability especially with cureskin.
 Odin.Upbeat
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By Odin.Upbeat 2011-11-29 06:25:56
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I was wearing Flawless Ribbon, KO, and 2 Arete Del Sol both with Augmented Light Resist +13/16 all that plus Shell II. Neither Holly or Holy II could break SS.
 Phoenix.Urteil
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By Phoenix.Urteil 2011-11-29 07:01:28
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WHM/RDM with a single Magian mab club is going to shatter SS.


I'm also sure you don't just have 14% mdt from shell, probably a Dark Ring or two, and light resist is antiquated their divine skill is far too high to have it matter.
 Odin.Upbeat
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By Odin.Upbeat 2011-11-29 10:01:36
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 Odin.Sawtelle
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By Odin.Sawtelle 2011-11-29 17:35:19
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I definitally need to get more used to PvP on whm, from your angle I did even worse than from mine><

Will get revenge once I get moar gear!
 Odin.Upbeat
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By Odin.Upbeat 2011-11-29 18:13:48
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At least you actually tried, that's more than most can say. Guessing from what Uriel said getting a Magian mab club along with some form of a PDT set would be the ideal way to go.

/NIN might even be an option, but I could switch to /RDM and strip your shadows.

Hmmmm I can't really think of anything aside from some small gear improvements and a lot of luck lol

WHM/SCH somehow catch me with sublimation off, get sleep off, Aspir all my MP... Stay alive long enough to kill me with a club.

Or maybe

WHM/DNCorNIN Gambanteinn/KC Degan spam along with some Holy casts and just outlasting.
With sushi that actually could work, I would bet on it getting a few kills.
 Odin.Sawtelle
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By Odin.Sawtelle 2011-11-29 18:24:50
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I hate to say its not my current plan to get a Kclub (and likely no gamba anytime soon) but I do want to try some ideas I have as a /rdm against you somepoint when you are up to kill me some more!(plus I need to get more used to PvP. watching that video reminds me of some of my first starcraft games where the mistakes are so obvious in retrospect, but get made from not being used to it yet)

edit: this was the set I was using

Item Set


Plan to switch to terra's if /rdm, and get better dark rings. Will replace medicine earring once I get better dark rings. Looking to buy blessed mitts/boots+1 and HQ cape. Likely would like a haste belt also. Was looking for a fill in club and the chariot in grauberg drops one with some mp, a little fast cast and enfire if /rdm doesn't work out. Any other ideas?
 Odin.Upbeat
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By Odin.Upbeat 2011-11-29 20:06:59
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ummm a 2~4 attack club and 2~3 attack club dual wielded lol I have no idea.
Or maybe!
WHM/SAM save up 200+ TP, wipe shadows, Sekkanoki, WS, WS, med, WS. Black Halo -> Hexa -> Light SC -> Hexa... Not sure how well it would actually work, that might not even be the best order of WSs, but it's a possibility.

If you need help getting that club from the chariot just send a /tell, I'll come tank it or proc it for you.

EDIT: And MB Holy II off the Light SC! I think we might be getting somewhere now haha
[+]
 Phoenix.Urteil
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By Phoenix.Urteil 2011-11-30 04:51:50
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Empyrean club is good for the ODD coupled with a 2-4 or a magian.

The ODD club is amazing Kraken Club is worthless and get's 0'd out too easily.


And the best of course being mjolnir/magian mab club for either high base DMG hexa or Flash Nova with some added oomph (also for help with divine based nukes.)
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By Phoenix.Urteil 2011-11-30 04:53:16
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Odin.Upbeat said: »

Is this whm/sch or /rdm? /rdm caters to more offense and /sch to having amazing MP resources with counter-aspir/drain.


He's having way too many MP troubles for you not having access to Aspir II and his Holy Damage is low, definitely need PDT/MAB+ gear, that would make the fight go more in his favor.


WHM is very technical and requires precise timing and MP management despite having a large pool. Its by no means the easiest job to play but has a lot of potential in both very defensive and offensive styles of play which are modulated mostly by gear choices and specific setups via magian weapons etc.

Practice will make perfect! And probably illuminate more of the strategies it has to offer.



**Edit

Food/consumables in duels r for nabs D:
 Odin.Upbeat
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By Odin.Upbeat 2011-11-30 07:12:02
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He was WHM/PLD. This was his first time fighting me anyways so he might not of known what to expect.

With the new club WS, Realmrazer, being a Seven-Hit I think the WHM/SAM idea could be better than ever after the level cap update.
 Bismarck.Hisagi
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By Bismarck.Hisagi 2011-11-30 08:25:53
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WHM/RDM was beating mnks back to 75 cap, i guess /RDM still the better option with a strong club, kc is useless.
 Odin.Upbeat
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By Odin.Upbeat 2011-11-30 08:33:18
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Can't really call KC useless, you guys act like it's going to hit for 0 every single time. I don't have THAT much def/pdt on NIN/SCH hits will deal some damage, and as long as they're doing anything over 0 it's getting the job of a KC done.

Now if I was /RDM and used Phalanx with some PDT stuff it might be a different story, but with just vs NIN/SCH I can't see how subbing a KC would be pointless.

I'm just talking about vs a NIN. /KC vs any other job with decent DEF(BLU, PLD, RDM, ect) I'll agree is useless most of the time.
 Bahamut.Raenryong
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By Bahamut.Raenryong 2011-11-30 08:41:09
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Nice video aside from the wubstep ;;

I really wish PvP in FFXI was more mainstream (and convenient to do)...
 Bismarck.Hisagi
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By Bismarck.Hisagi 2011-11-30 13:22:12
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If u do ballista u should always go with DEF gears even if u have to sacrifice ur attack/MP/ w/e, unless u are a thf o nin then eva > def.
Atleast this is what i remember of ballista
 Odin.Upbeat
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By Odin.Upbeat 2011-11-30 13:32:04
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Lol wut

Times have changed is all I can say, not that gearing strictly for DEF was ever the best way to go even at 75.

With NIN gearing for MaB/INT is the best way to go in almost any fight.
 Phoenix.Nightson
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By Phoenix.Nightson 2011-11-30 13:41:14
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well whats the limit on en spells for multihits? wouldnt enspells 1 be worth it for a kclub whm/rdm? even if 0'd out on main i would think the en dmg would make up for it. But then again i dont use en anything ever when i go in there so asking for clarity from people who would know....
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