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Shijin Spiral
 Bahamut.Mizuharu
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1988
By Bahamut.Mizuharu 2011-12-17 23:07:57
I still say this WS is moreso made for pup, with the dex mod. Pup gets some insane dex gear and a high dex base. Mine is only 1/5 so far, so I can't give ya good numbers yet though :(. Do you think you could post a gear set? because idk what good dex pieces there are for pup aside from Toci's and ocelomeh headpiece.
What I use atm is...
Ideal set up?
Note I put the NQ over HQ headpiece. That's because F--- paying 7mil more for 1 dex. Also, there are some gloves with all stats+7 enhances elemental WS damage. But, cirque gloves are 1 dex less and have STP for TP return on a WS. And free (provided you farm seals/+2 mats. <.<) And, unless the WS is Asuran Fists, ALWAYS WS in Brutals/Epona. That's just my little tidbit >_> And really, so long as you have Animator +1, I'd use that over Deluxe Animator unless they found some other hidden effect. 4 DEX + HP/MP bonus to automaton > 2 dex imo... :<
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Phoenix.Zekky
サーバ: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 201
By Phoenix.Zekky 2011-12-17 23:18:46
I have enjoyed Penance + plague + 50% SB on mobs. Especially for outside of Abyssea where mobs tend to live a little bit longer than those inside of Abyssea.
Bahamut.Mizuharu
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1988
By Bahamut.Mizuharu 2011-12-17 23:47:24
Slightly off topic, I like how this was posted in the monk section, but PUPs are posting here... Kinda like how the dagger WS had a post in the THF section, and everyone started posting DNC set ups. lol
Phoenix.Zekky
サーバ: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 201
By Phoenix.Zekky 2011-12-17 23:55:13
PUPs are our brothers from another mother.
サーバ: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 27982
By Shiva.Spathaian 2011-12-18 00:32:06
PUPs are our brothers from another mother. :x I wish this was how MNKs felt about me. lmao
Phoenix.Zekky
サーバ: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 201
By Phoenix.Zekky 2011-12-18 00:35:46
PUPs are our brothers from another mother. :x I wish this was how MNKs felt about me. lmao Don't worry. I do. I am a huge lover of PUPs since 75 cap and still am.
Bahamut.Mizuharu
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1988
By Bahamut.Mizuharu 2011-12-18 00:37:24
I just kinda put this together for MNKs. (I -think- it's ideal. My MNK is, like, 21.)
Left ammo empty because idk if you're prefer Potestas Bomblet for the raw atk, or Demonry core for the DEX+4. I suppose you could swap them since you don't lose TP WSing...
(Kinda wondering if gorgets are worth it. I assumed this WS had a weird fTP like Skydiver that was on each hit of the WS.)
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 65
By Sylph.Ballzack 2011-12-18 01:46:44
Think Im going to go with this for Pup
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2202
By Asura.Karbuncle 2011-12-18 03:38:06
I think Pantin Cape would be better, DEX+5 and Attack+15.
As well, those new (All Stats)+7 Gloves for hands, of course And how would Maat's Cap line up with the ACP Head?
Bahamut.Mizuharu
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1988
By Bahamut.Mizuharu 2011-12-18 03:51:42
I think Pantin Cape would be better, DEX+5 and Attack+15.
As well, those new (All Stats)+7 Gloves for hands, of course And how would Maat's Cap line up with the ACP Head?
Depending on how much of a pain those gloves are, I might just stick with Cirque hands +2. One less stat, but have the Store TP for the TP return on weapon skills. As for Maat vs ACP, how much damage does each point of dex add to the weapon skill? I think someone said that, with Empy Weapon Skills, 60% mod was 4 stat mod = 2 weapon damage (not entirely sure about this, so if someone could correct/clarify it, that'd be nice.)
 Leviathan.Pimpchan
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 756
By Leviathan.Pimpchan 2011-12-18 04:24:39
Hi noobs, you can prove that attack gloves like bandomusha or AF2+2 beat 10 dex (hachiryu) and that aesir ear (7 attack) beats a dex 4 earring. An ideal set for monk looks like
Spharai 99 // potestas bomblet
Ocemoleh head+1 // flame gorget // brutal // aesir
Toci's harness // Melee gloves +2// rajas // eponas
atheling // artful+1 // byakko // athos (until denali+5)
After verification 22 attack beats 14 dex and 10 dex beats 15 attack
Quetzalcoatl.Dawnn
サーバ: Quetzalcoatl
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1041
By Quetzalcoatl.Dawnn 2011-12-18 04:56:39
Leviathan.Pimpchan said: »Hi noobs, you can prove that attack gloves like bandomusha or AF2+2 beat 10 dex (hachiryu) and that aesir ear (7 attack) beats a dex 4 earring. An ideal set for monk looks like
Spharai 99 // potestas bomblet
Ocemoleh head+1 // flame gorget // brutal // aesir
Toci's harness // Melee gloves +2// rajas // eponas
atheling // artful+1 // byakko // athos (until denali+5)
After verification 22 attack beats 14 dex and 10 dex beats 15 attack
I'd think that it would vary with buffs, situational gear is situational
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 65
By Sylph.Ballzack 2011-12-18 06:00:48
I totally forgot Pantin had Dex on it! As for hands I havent looked into em but I like my AF3+2 so Ima say meh and go with those unless I get lucky and If Its a VW drop (Havent gotten ***from any mob thats worth while) then forget em. I have horrid luck with VW while some people get great stuff back to back. SMH!!!.
Bahamut.Mizuharu
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1988
By Bahamut.Mizuharu 2011-12-18 12:01:26
Leviathan.Pimpchan said: »Hi noobs, you can prove that attack gloves like bandomusha or AF2+2 beat 10 dex (hachiryu) and that aesir ear (7 attack) beats a dex 4 earring. An ideal set for monk looks like
Spharai 99 // potestas bomblet
Ocemoleh head+1 // flame gorget // brutal // aesir
Toci's harness // Melee gloves +2// rajas // eponas
atheling // artful+1 // byakko // athos (until denali+5)
After verification 22 attack beats 14 dex and 10 dex beats 15 attack
Hi noob. I'm not a Monk. >: And what you said depends on the situation...
Quetzalcoatl.Dawnn said: »situational gear is situational
Asura.Fuxi
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 28
By Asura.Fuxi 2011-12-18 12:09:28
Despite having VS I still use Shijin just to hear the CAAAW! sound. or am I just hallucinating that?
サーバ: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1901
By Odin.Hitoseijuro 2011-12-20 14:06:13
Quetzalcoatl.Dawnn said: »I'd think that it would vary with buffs, situational gear is situational Pretty much that. Bando didnt beat out Hachi, because youll probably be /war and a Cor not to mention being able to replenish your drinks. That being said I had already plugged in Bando vs hachi and it didnt even win with just RCB+/war no reason to think it would with drinks+cor.
Relic+2 is definately better provided you make good use of all of the buffs.
Rajas vs Thundersoul can go either way. If you happen to have thundersoul, no reason not to use it with impetus/berserk up(assuming you dont have VS) and rajas when buffs are down.
I dont see how 7att is going to compete with 4dex considering the mod, it was already even if not less vs a 4str earring with a lower mod and so far from plugging in stuff, it hasnt been better than 4dex, granted its with /war + RCB. However, I will note that if you're subbing /nin, 7att is better.
Note: My approach to this ws was as /war. If you're /nin the attack pieces are likely to be better.
サーバ: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 11680
By Fenrir.Nightfyre 2011-12-20 14:27:26
Leviathan.Pimpchan said: »Hi noobs, you can prove that attack gloves like bandomusha or AF2+2 beat 10 dex (hachiryu) and that aesir ear (7 attack) beats a dex 4 earring. An ideal set for monk looks like
Spharai 99 // potestas bomblet
Ocemoleh head+1 // flame gorget // brutal // aesir
Toci's harness // Melee gloves +2// rajas // eponas
atheling // artful+1 // byakko // athos (until denali+5)
After verification 22 attack beats 14 dex and 10 dex beats 15 attack I thought you didn't care about WS gearswaps?
Bahamut.Mizuharu
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1988
By Bahamut.Mizuharu 2011-12-20 15:04:12
Leviathan.Pimpchan said: »Hi noobs, you can prove that attack gloves like bandomusha or AF2+2 beat 10 dex (hachiryu) and that aesir ear (7 attack) beats a dex 4 earring. An ideal set for monk looks like
Spharai 99 // potestas bomblet
Ocemoleh head+1 // flame gorget // brutal // aesir
Toci's harness // Melee gloves +2// rajas // eponas
atheling // artful+1 // byakko // athos (until denali+5)
After verification 22 attack beats 14 dex and 10 dex beats 15 attack I thought you didn't care about WS gearswaps?
What would life be without you, Nightfyre?
It wouldn't be to begin with.
Bahamut.Ukiyasan
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 401
By Bahamut.Ukiyasan 2011-12-20 15:17:07
Leviathan.Pimpchan said: »Hi noobs, you can prove that attack gloves like bandomusha or AF2+2 beat 10 dex (hachiryu) and that aesir ear (7 attack) beats a dex 4 earring. An ideal set for monk looks like
Spharai 99 // potestas bomblet
Ocemoleh head+1 // flame gorget // brutal // aesir
Toci's harness // Melee gloves +2// rajas // eponas
atheling // artful+1 // byakko // athos (until denali+5)
After verification 22 attack beats 14 dex and 10 dex beats 15 attack Have we all not figured to ignore 'GimpChan' because all he ever does is troll? I don't think I have seen one reasonable post ever from this joker.
Also, to make a statement...while Victory Smite is better than this 5/5 for MNK, I have still seen (Yes, it is eyeballed) some very comparable damage from people that have 5/5 this because they don't have Smite yet. Also, I'm not sure how this would compare to Smite for PUP. I'm assuming by the high PUP discussion, that it must been a possible side-grade.
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Bahamut.Serj
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6179
By Bahamut.Serj 2011-12-20 15:17:23
You can't use that anymore.
Hmmm, does hell get censored? Might have to edit it...
Ragnarok.Ashman
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4251
By Ragnarok.Ashman 2011-12-20 15:30:00
You can't use that anymore.
Sadly, Flion is gone and Usuchan is still here. I at least found Flion amusing and he was polite to me. I can't remember a time that pimpchan posted anything of value, or wasn't quoted with an air of disdain and contempt :/
I don't think I have seen one reasonable post ever from this joker.
Mizu's set is lacking a little attack though. I would personally use potestas and atheling for the attack boost (unless I were on super low defense stuff). Situational etc etc
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サーバ: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1901
By Odin.Hitoseijuro 2011-12-20 15:50:09
Mizu's set is lacking a little attack though. I would personally use potestas and atheling for the attack boost (unless I were on super low defense stuff). Situational etc etc Check the main page, I updated the original set already for the update. It should have a decent amount of att/acc and dex. The higher attack buffs you have as far as support/items, the more likely gorget/Artful+1 will be better.
Im not sure if Kine has updated Shijin with w/e update the ws were given(if Shijin was one of them) ie idk how up todate Kine's formula for Shijin is.
Bahamut.Mizuharu
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1988
By Bahamut.Mizuharu 2011-12-20 15:54:36
Just going by the BG wiki here, but it doesn't say if Shijin's fTP is across all hits. So yeah Artful +1 and a DEX or ATK neck piece might be best (I'm using love torque)
VIP
サーバ: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 764
By Fenrir.Motenten 2011-12-21 00:03:58
Mnk spreadsheet should be fully up to date now. All weaponskills on it now also account for Conserve TP and Save TP, as well as the possibility of quadruple attack (melee does not because I'm not sure how QA would interact with kicks or double kicks).
fTP is 1.0625, rough testing (not the test I would have preferred, but workable) indicated that fTP probably does not carry across all hits. Attack bonus appears to be 5%.
Leviathan.Pimpchan
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 756
By Leviathan.Pimpchan 2011-12-21 05:16:27
Just going by the BG wiki here, but it doesn't say if Shijin's fTP is across all hits. So yeah Artful +1 and a DEX or ATK neck piece might be best (I'm using love torque)
It's normal noone on BG can do proper test. The 1.0625 comes from JPs, verified by me and mdk on the offical forums, monk threads. It's impossible to guarrantee that it is 100% accurate but it's 100% certain to lie between 1.05 and 1.1 and 100% dex seems very likely too. The attack boost has been tested by myself, it's not perfect but that's due to BG wiki average pdif being wrong (which is a probleme forcalculing damage too). The ftp not carrying over further hits was shown also by me. Don't need super elobarated tests to do it as a 10% variation in averaged WS will be noticed after a couple of dozens of WS.
 Siren.Julio
サーバ: Siren
Game: FFXI
Posts: 46
By Siren.Julio 2011-12-21 06:38:19
I'm liking Shijin Spiral so far. I have parsed a number of dynamis-bubu runs using VS and Spiral and if taken with a grain of salt the results are promising:
Lvl 95 MNK, Lvl 90 Revenant Fists, sample size around 100 WSs, varying Impetus up/down, Focus up/down, varying food, EP mobs (note too many variables not controlled for) - avg VS dmg ~1750-1800
Lvl 99 MNK, lvl 95 Spharai, sample size around 80 WSs, varying Impetus up/down, Focus up/down, no food, DC mobs - avg. SP dmg. ~1950-2050
The difference is likely attributed to the level difference and base weapon damage. Neither of the WS sets are optimal, so this can have caused variance too. Finally, I've tested on EP and DC mobs outside abyssea, which is not really content that "matters".
On Qilin I am averaging SPs of around 780-800. Haven't been able to parse VS results on it due to always being WHM on previous runs. In total damage I was parsing on par with emp WAR, THF and DRG, above relic RNG, emp COR. Most of this damage is attributed to the TP phase obviously and since I had hate alot I lost some rounds due to using meds and playing for survivability/procs.
I am not at all unsatisified.
Siren.Julio
サーバ: Siren
Game: FFXI
Posts: 46
By Siren.Julio 2011-12-21 14:34:49
Today's Dynamis-Valkurm results:
(TE mobs included, farmed on DC mobs exclusively)
Damage Summary
Player Total Dmg Damage % Melee Dmg Range Dmg Abil. Dmg WSkill Dmg Spell Dmg Other Dmg Absorbed Dmg[/b]
Julio 774287 99.05 % 518848 0 212859 0 0 42580 0
SC: Fusion 7439 0.95 % 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
Total 781726 100.00 % 518848 0 212859 0 0 42580 0
Melee Damage
Player Melee Dmg Abs'd.Dmg Net Dmg Melee % Hit/Miss M.HR % M.Acc % M.Low/Hi M+0.Avg M-0.Avg[/b]
Julio 518848 0 518848 67.01 % 2411/122 95.18 % 95.18 % 18/722 183.58 183.58
Melee Crit Damage
Player #Crit C.Low/Hi C-0.Avg Crit%[/b]
Julio 448 88/1483 353.77 18.58 %
Other Physical Damage (Counterattacks and Retaliations)
Player CA.Dmg CA.Hits-0 CA.Low/Hi CA-0.Avg Ret.Dmg Ret.Hits-0 Ret.Low/Hi Ret-0.Avg[/b]
Julio 42580 118 55/2228 360.85 0 0 0/0 0.00
Ability Damage
Player Abil. Dmg Abs'd.Dmg Net Dmg Abil. % Hit/Miss A.Acc % A.Low/Hi A.Avg[/b]
Julio 212859 0 212859 27.49 % 203/0 100.00 % 51/3547 1048.57
- Chi Blast 1227 0 1227 0.58 % 16/0 100.00 % 51/98 76.69
- Shijin Spiral 197054 0 197054 92.57 % 100/0 100.00 % 499/3547 1970.54
- Violent Flourish 14578 0 14578 6.85 % 87/0 100.00 % 112/243 167.56
Skillchain Damage
Skillchain SC Dmg Abs'd.Dmg Net Dmg # SC SC.Low/Hi SC.Avg[/b]
SC: Fusion 7439 0 7439 5 1092/1756 1487.80
Shijin Spiral : 5 hit ws, additiona effect: Plague. Tp modifies the chances of plague.
Dex mod, 5/5 merits is said to be a 100% Mod.
That being said I thought for people thinking of unlocking this ws for whatever reason might consider a build like this:
note: Prosilio/Justicier pieces for low attack buffs/berserk down. Athos gloves for high buffs/non-high def mob.
My main overall goal with this build was balance, I didnt go all out on mod gear pieces outside of pieces that contained a good enough boost. The other slots I filled in with attack and accuracy.
Not sure if this warrants a new thread, but I didnt want to hi-jack the smite thread, and people who are interested will post and help, those not will not.
Additional builds: So I realize that this top build focus more on high-tier gear. Not everyone has access/time for that nor the gil for that. That being said Im hoping the next 2 pieces(mid level, lower level) builds are reasonable for people.
Hito, I dont have gil to spend nor do I do VW, what can I substitute for now til I do??
Mid-level
Hito I dont do salvage nor plan to, Im limited on abyssea aswell or drops just dont drop.
Lower-level
Notes: I know KO has more dex/str over Usukane and nice augments, but I chose Usukane over that for the +12 accuracy as the acc was lower in that build. I chose shura kabuto for that, as the only available head piece without accounting for VW/Abyssea was +6, I think the NQs +2% ws would be better than 6 dex along side the accuracy and str/att. If you dont have shura, go with the +6 dex piece or if you already have, go with A.bonnet.
If you have victory smite, I wouldnt consider Shijin if you cant have access to higher tier gear. Medium tier probably wont cut it if you have VS.
Hope to get some helpful critiques on the 2 builds again, with reasonable understanding of why the build are set how they are.
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