Random Politics & Religion #22

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Random Politics & Religion #22
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By fonewear 2017-04-03 18:16:40  
Shiva.Shruiken said: »
Blackwater founder held meeting to establish Trump-Russia backchannel

The Hill said:
Blackwater founder Erik Prince met with a Russian close to President Vladimir Putin in early January in what The Washington Post reports was an apparent effort to create a back channel line of communications between Moscow and the incoming Trump administration.

The meeting, on the Seychelles islands, reportedly occurred less than two weeks before President Trump’s inauguration.

The Unite Arab Emirates agreed to arrange the meeting in order to see if Russia might roll back its support for Iran, including its ties in Syria, the Post reports.

The full agenda of the meeting, however, is still unclear.

Fun fact Blackwater founder Erik Prince is the brother of Secretary of Education Betsy DeVos.

inb4 "facts I don't like WaPo!!"

Washington Post brought to you by Amazon.com act now and get free shipping !
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By fonewear 2017-04-03 18:19:11  
The real news is that we are on page 3 and Donny is missing in action.
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By Garuda.Chanti 2017-04-03 18:25:13  
Asura.Saevel said: »
Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
He might as well be saying "Well my ideology cannot be flawed, so the only cognitive dissonance option I can rationalize is that Trump and his team MUST be criminals!"
That is why I call their ideology a religion, it's based purely on faith. They have faith that their ideological God is perfect and can not be wrong, thus anything that disagree's with it must be bad.
I just read a long piece that went deep into that faith concept.

Donald Trump’s Fictional America

I grew up surrounded by Chávez’s alternate reality. Now I’m watching one consume the United States.

Politico Magazine
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By Phoenix.Xantavia 2017-04-03 18:27:10  
Bahamut.Ravael said: »
Garuda.Chanti said: »
The LA Times is REALLY down on Trump.

Erm, that's the way the LA Times has always been.

But using Chanti's style, here's an excerpt of an article from a Democrat at the NY Daily News:

If Dems block Neil Gorsuch, we all lose if GOP goes 'nuclear'

Quote:
Memo to my fellow Democrat — and fellow Brooklynite — Chuck Schumer: You picked the wrong hill to die on.

Schumer, of course, is the leader of the Democratic Party in the Senate (which, these days is kind of like being the head water quality inspector at the EPA branch office in Wheeling, W.Va. — the title sounds good, but it’s ostensibly meaningless when the President is literally burning your files and putting your desk on the sidewalk under a sign reading “Free stuff”).

And now he the Democrats have decided to filibuster the Supreme Court nomination of federal judge Neil Gorsuch, who, no matter what you think of him, is qualified to serve on the High Court.
I still can't understand this. Give in now so the GOP gets what they want, so they can use the nuclear option if it comes up again. Or force them to use it now, so they get what they want and can get what they want in the future. Same basic outcome, so why not force them to sink the filibuster right now.
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By fonewear 2017-04-03 18:37:17  
Garuda.Chanti said: »
Asura.Saevel said: »
Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
He might as well be saying "Well my ideology cannot be flawed, so the only cognitive dissonance option I can rationalize is that Trump and his team MUST be criminals!"
That is why I call their ideology a religion, it's based purely on faith. They have faith that their ideological God is perfect and can not be wrong, thus anything that disagree's with it must be bad.
I just read a long piece that went deep into that faith concept.

Donald Trump’s Fictional America

I grew up surrounded by Chávez’s alternate reality. Now I’m watching one consume the United States.

Politico Magazine

The author did not defined what reality is. So it seems like this guy is living in an alternative reality.
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2017-04-03 18:48:47  
Phoenix.Xantavia said: »
Bahamut.Ravael said: »
Garuda.Chanti said: »
The LA Times is REALLY down on Trump.

Erm, that's the way the LA Times has always been.

But using Chanti's style, here's an excerpt of an article from a Democrat at the NY Daily News:

If Dems block Neil Gorsuch, we all lose if GOP goes 'nuclear'

Quote:
Memo to my fellow Democrat — and fellow Brooklynite — Chuck Schumer: You picked the wrong hill to die on.

Schumer, of course, is the leader of the Democratic Party in the Senate (which, these days is kind of like being the head water quality inspector at the EPA branch office in Wheeling, W.Va. — the title sounds good, but it’s ostensibly meaningless when the President is literally burning your files and putting your desk on the sidewalk under a sign reading “Free stuff”).

And now he the Democrats have decided to filibuster the Supreme Court nomination of federal judge Neil Gorsuch, who, no matter what you think of him, is qualified to serve on the High Court.
I still can't understand this. Give in now so the GOP gets what they want, so they can use the nuclear option if it comes up again. Or force them to use it now, so they get what they want and can get what they want in the future. Same basic outcome, so why not force them to sink the filibuster right now.

There are multiple reasons why it's a stupid idea. It's one thing to stage an opposition protest to a Betsy DeVos type, where nobody can really blame you. It's an entirely different thing to stage a protest to the most agreeable judge Trump could possibly pick, with a nearly impeccable record to boot. It makes you look petty, and completely invalidates your objections to the Republican obstructionism of years past.

Another reason is that while the Senate can basically launch the nuclear option at any point, having it active serves as a protective veil against more extreme options. And let's use DeVos as an option again. If Reid hadn't changed the rules before, do you really believe that Republicans would have gone nuclear to get someone like her in? Absolutely not. She would have been blocked, and you'd have someone else in her spot right now. The same goes with the Supreme Court. With the filibuster gone, Trump can pick a party-line hyper-conservative to fill the next spot without even the pretense of caring about bipartisan support.
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By Lakshmi.Zerowone 2017-04-03 18:52:58  
Shiva.Shruiken said: »
Blackwater founder held meeting to establish Trump-Russia backchannel

The Hill said:
Blackwater founder Erik Prince met with a Russian close to President Vladimir Putin in early January in what The Washington Post reports was an apparent effort to create a back channel line of communications between Moscow and the incoming Trump administration.

The meeting, on the Seychelles islands, reportedly occurred less than two weeks before President Trump’s inauguration.

The Unite Arab Emirates agreed to arrange the meeting in order to see if Russia might roll back its support for Iran, including its ties in Syria, the Post reports.

The full agenda of the meeting, however, is still unclear.

Fun fact Blackwater founder Erik Prince is the brother of Secretary of Education Betsy DeVos.

inb4 "facts I don't like WaPo!!"

Another fun fact, Amway is owned by the DeVos family and is involved in that intriguing communication 3 way involving Trump servers, Alfa Bank in Russia and Amway.

These dots, are they claimed to be mutually exclusive? Cause when start connecting...
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2017-04-03 19:15:36  
Lakshmi.Zerowone said: »
Shiva.Shruiken said: »
Blackwater founder held meeting to establish Trump-Russia backchannel

The Hill said:
Blackwater founder Erik Prince met with a Russian close to President Vladimir Putin in early January in what The Washington Post reports was an apparent effort to create a back channel line of communications between Moscow and the incoming Trump administration.

The meeting, on the Seychelles islands, reportedly occurred less than two weeks before President Trump’s inauguration.

The Unite Arab Emirates agreed to arrange the meeting in order to see if Russia might roll back its support for Iran, including its ties in Syria, the Post reports.

The full agenda of the meeting, however, is still unclear.

Fun fact Blackwater founder Erik Prince is the brother of Secretary of Education Betsy DeVos.

inb4 "facts I don't like WaPo!!"

Another fun fact, Amway is owned by the DeVos family and is involved in that intriguing communication 3 way involving Trump servers, Alfa Bank in Russia and Amway.

These dots, are they claimed to be mutually exclusive? Cause when start connecting...

Yeah, I can't believe that powerful people would have family members that are also powerful, and that they would have connections with other powerful people. It's extra suspicious when it's a Republican and we're predisposed to be suspicious of them anyway.
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By Garuda.Chanti 2017-04-03 19:21:49  
Bahamut.Ravael said: »
Phoenix.Xantavia said: »
I still can't understand this. Give in now so the GOP gets what they want, so they can use the nuclear option if it comes up again. Or force them to use it now, so they get what they want and can get what they want in the future. Same basic outcome, so why not force them to sink the filibuster right now.

There are multiple reasons why it's a stupid idea. It's one thing to stage an opposition protest to a Betsy DeVos type, where nobody can really blame you. It's an entirely different thing to stage a protest to the most agreeable judge Trump could possibly pick, with a nearly impeccable record to boot. It makes you look petty, and completely invalidates your objections to the Republican obstructionism of years past.

Another reason is that while the Senate can basically launch the nuclear option at any point, having it active serves as a protective veil against more extreme options. And let's use DeVos as an option again. If Reid hadn't changed the rules before, do you really believe that Republicans would have gone nuclear to get someone like her in? Absolutely not. She would have been blocked, and you'd have someone else in her spot right now. The same goes with the Supreme Court. With the filibuster gone, Trump can pick a party-line hyper-conservative to fill the next spot without even the pretense of caring about bipartisan support.
Then why did the GOP even refuse to give Garland even a hearing?

I mean they slapped the president in the face with a 2 week dead flounder. And the Democrats will not forget it.

And if the GOP uses the nuclear option it energizes the dems base. And they REALLY need to turn their base out in mid term elections.
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By fonewear 2017-04-03 19:24:46  
Oh the Democrats I'm so scared. Please protect me from them.
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By fonewear 2017-04-03 19:26:29  
Look he is going to be on the Supreme Court and there isn't a damned thing you can do about it.
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 Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2017-04-03 19:27:39  
Garuda.Chanti said: »
Bahamut.Ravael said: »
Phoenix.Xantavia said: »
I still can't understand this. Give in now so the GOP gets what they want, so they can use the nuclear option if it comes up again. Or force them to use it now, so they get what they want and can get what they want in the future. Same basic outcome, so why not force them to sink the filibuster right now.

There are multiple reasons why it's a stupid idea. It's one thing to stage an opposition protest to a Betsy DeVos type, where nobody can really blame you. It's an entirely different thing to stage a protest to the most agreeable judge Trump could possibly pick, with a nearly impeccable record to boot. It makes you look petty, and completely invalidates your objections to the Republican obstructionism of years past.

Another reason is that while the Senate can basically launch the nuclear option at any point, having it active serves as a protective veil against more extreme options. And let's use DeVos as an option again. If Reid hadn't changed the rules before, do you really believe that Republicans would have gone nuclear to get someone like her in? Absolutely not. She would have been blocked, and you'd have someone else in her spot right now. The same goes with the Supreme Court. With the filibuster gone, Trump can pick a party-line hyper-conservative to fill the next spot without even the pretense of caring about bipartisan support.
Then why did the GOP even refuse to give Garland even a hearing?

I mean they slapped the president in the face with a 2 week dead flounder. And the Democrats will not forget it.

And if the GOP uses the nuclear option it energizes the dems base. And they REALLY need to turn their base out in mid term elections.

The GOP should have given Garland a hearing at the very least... even though the precedent of not allowing a justice through in an election year was set by none other than Joe Biden. And the nuclear option likewise does not motivate the Dem base, because they know it's just an extension of what Harry Reid did. If Democrats want a real weapon against Republicans, they should try not opening the door to these sleazebag tactics in the first place.
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By Ruaumoko 2017-04-03 19:32:25  
Not sure what I make of the GOP going nuclear on the SCOTUS nomination.

Sure they have a right to get things rolling but that the GOP didn't even have a hearing for the previous administration's choice yet they're pushing this through, damned the consequences. It doesn't sit entirely right with me. I guess that's me just looking in from the outside though.

Bipartisanship is well and truly dead.
What was the time of death, anyone?
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By Viciouss 2017-04-03 19:36:54  
Joe Biden making a comment that had no impact on the Supreme Court does not set any precedent. There was no precedent for blocking Garland.
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2017-04-03 19:44:05  
Viciouss said: »
Joe Biden making a comment that had no impact on the Supreme Court does not set any precedent. There was no precedent for blocking Garland.

Did anyone object to Biden's suggestion on the Democrat side when he made the comment? Oh yeah, they thought it was a great idea... until it bit them. It's just the same old hypocritical partisan nonsense.

If it makes you feel any better, if Garland had gone to vote he wouldn't have passed anyway.
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By Viciouss 2017-04-03 19:47:22  
I don't have the '92 transcript. It was a hypothetical situation, completely different than the real world.
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By fonewear 2017-04-03 19:48:55  
Who cares about Garland you guys are living in the past.
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By Cerberus.Pleebo 2017-04-03 19:51:13  
That time that Democrats didn't block a supreme court nomination is just like that time that Republicans did block a nomination.
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By Garuda.Chanti 2017-04-03 19:52:33  
Bahamut.Ravael said: »
The GOP should have given Garland a hearing at the very least... even though the precedent of not allowing a justice through in an election year was set by none other than Joe Biden....
It was not. Not going to do the research on that currently but that was falsified almost the moment turtleman said it.
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By fonewear 2017-04-03 19:53:58  
If you are unhappy about the nominee get off your *** and go to law school. Do something about it bitching after he gets appointed isn't productive.
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By Garuda.Chanti 2017-04-03 19:55:31  
Ruaumoko said: »
....
Bipartisanship is well and truly dead.
What was the time of death, anyone?
Tuesday, January 20, 2009.
 Lakshmi.Zerowone
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By Lakshmi.Zerowone 2017-04-03 19:55:59  
Bahamut.Ravael said: »
Lakshmi.Zerowone said: »
Shiva.Shruiken said: »
Blackwater founder held meeting to establish Trump-Russia backchannel

The Hill said:
Blackwater founder Erik Prince met with a Russian close to President Vladimir Putin in early January in what The Washington Post reports was an apparent effort to create a back channel line of communications between Moscow and the incoming Trump administration.

The meeting, on the Seychelles islands, reportedly occurred less than two weeks before President Trump’s inauguration.

The Unite Arab Emirates agreed to arrange the meeting in order to see if Russia might roll back its support for Iran, including its ties in Syria, the Post reports.

The full agenda of the meeting, however, is still unclear.

Fun fact Blackwater founder Erik Prince is the brother of Secretary of Education Betsy DeVos.

inb4 "facts I don't like WaPo!!"

Another fun fact, Amway is owned by the DeVos family and is involved in that intriguing communication 3 way involving Trump servers, Alfa Bank in Russia and Amway.

These dots, are they claimed to be mutually exclusive? Cause when start connecting...

Yeah, I can't believe that powerful people would have family members that are also powerful, and that they would have connections with other powerful people. It's extra suspicious when it's a Clinton and we're predisposed to be suspicious of them anyway.

It's funny how that flippant response is applicable both ways
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By fonewear 2017-04-03 19:57:12  
Garuda.Chanti said: »
Ruaumoko said: »
....
Bipartisanship is well and truly dead.
What was the time of death, anyone?
Tuesday, January 20, 2009.

Obama mania yea I remember people crying in the streets cause the savoir was elected.
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By Lakshmi.Zerowone 2017-04-03 19:58:13  
fonewear said: »
If you are unhappy about the nominee get off your *** and go to law school. Do something about it bitching after he gets appointed isn't productive.

That would make sense up until this past Friday when the bar association was removed from the vetting process.
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By Garuda.Chanti 2017-04-03 20:07:55  
fonewear said: »
If you are unhappy about the nominee get off your *** and go to law school. Do something about it bitching after he gets appointed isn't productive.
Fone, I ran away from law school. I come from a large extended Jewish family just chock full of Jewish lawyers.

While bitching isn't productive, it feels good. And takes less effort than voting.
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By fonewear 2017-04-03 20:08:44  
A Jewish lawyer such a thing is a myth surely !
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By fonewear 2017-04-03 20:11:31  
I try my best to be a stereotypical white male. It's hard our numbers are dwindling. This diversity thing seems to be taking off...
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2017-04-03 20:28:54  
Funny how no Democrats have a problem with what Biden proposed, but they make extra sure to condemn Republicans for actually doing it.
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By Viciouss 2017-04-03 20:35:24  
Bahamut.Ravael said: »
Funny how no Democrats have a problem with what Biden proposed, but they make extra sure to condemn Republicans for actually doing it.

Yep, funny how hypotheticals are different from the real world.
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2017-04-03 20:53:53  
Viciouss said: »
Bahamut.Ravael said: »
Funny how no Democrats have a problem with what Biden proposed, but they make extra sure to condemn Republicans for actually doing it.

Yep, funny how hypotheticals are different from the real world.

Yeah, kinda like how Trump's Muslim ban has never been proposed, but we have to make sure he can't enforce national security anyway.
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