WHM Useless Job

/thread

You're about the 4th person to say that now, and no one has given me any reason why. I can see that if you're the only healer, and if you're fighting something that can take 1k HP with one TP move, it would be useful. But the fact that WHM lacks the Fast Cast boosts that both SCH and RDM have, will generally mean that the WHM in question will get beaten to the punch if there's any other healer around, and what was potentially a 1k cure is now a 200 cure, for 130 MP.

inb4 he tries to act like he was trolling

Remove every mage job from the game but SCH since they are all useless!

I'm not trolling. I quit, I don't give a *** about any jobs in this game.

The good thing about that is that it lets me take a step back and get out of the obvious bias in this thread, and point out the facts.

obvious bias lol. Youre the one always parading around how good sch is, just stop posting please

I say SCH is good because it is good.

Did I ever say WHM isn't a better healer? No. I said that everything a WHM has said thus far is exaggerated.

not even gonna bother, back to afk botting magian trials

Potency caps at +50%.

Not trying to sound like a noob myself for casting Cure IV, but i often toss Cure III or Cure IV when theirs a lot of healers around due to the fact that at most times the tank is going to be Cure bombed. Tossing a Cure V when a redmage with fast cast tosses a cure IV on someone with 600/1500 hp = a waste of mp. Imo its generally safer in those situations to rely on a cure IV. If however, theres only 1~3 healers, or their targets are spread out to keep alliance, then cure V is optimal

@Ent

If I recall correctly, Cure Clogs + Light Arts would boost Cure V casttime to the same speed as SCH or RDM speeds (barring unique Fast Cast gear for RDMs, of course). Even then, the Cure V isn't wasted with Afflatus Solace up, because you're still dropping a 250HP Stoneskin on the target with a 1K heal. Sure, there will be overflow potentially, but it's less of a lose with that added 250HP.

Everything else you listed above isn't useless at all, but they're definitely situational.

I never got used outta Esuna much until I started doing Einherjar, where it can be a godsend. Same with Cura, as that can basically be a Curaga II for 30MP in the right scenarios. Even outside of Einherjar, I've gotten use of Esuna in enfeeble-ga situations where needed.

Repose is good in a pinch. I use it a lot against dark resistant pet mobs in Dynamis when the BLMs and BRDs are busy/get resisted. Sure, it won't stick as long as a Sleep II because of the double dark weather persistent, but it works.

Sacrifice is a good combo with Esuna. Also, it works as another multi ailment Erase in certain instance. Take that -VIT and -AGI off your tank with no hurt to you. You won't even need to Erase those debuffs once you have them.

It just really does come down to how you play a class. All three healing mages in the game have very distinct play styles to them, and none of them are entirely useless. Just a matter of finding the play style that best suits you.

>.> /stare

I have 5/5 Cure Casting Time merits for -20% casting time.
Cure clogs for -15% Casting Time.
/sch Light Arts for 10% Fast Cast
Loquacious Earring for 2% Fast Cast

as I am now, I "Cure Snipe" every other mage including the RDM every single time.

Jewkitten cures target for 100-1000,
Othermage cures target for 0.

Speed is not an issue.

That is WITHOUT the new WHM neck that adds another -10% to Casting Time.

As for MP efficiency /sch Penury turns a 135MP spell into a 67.5mp spell. And even if my stratagems are on cool down I STILL cast CureV because it generates significantly less hate than CureIV.


Your opinions reflect that either you do not personally have the job leveled or you have played with mediocre WHM.

Yes, 90% of WHM I see have little or no Potency gear. Yes 95% of them have no Cure Casting Time gear or merits....

But a REAL and Serious WHM... > all.

SCH has to use a stratagem to beat WHM's cure by 5% potency. They can do that once a minute. However, once every two minutes WHM can do their cure at half the cost. Two cures would then come out to the cost of 1 cure, or 100% more of a WHM's normal cure, per say.

As opposed to the 20% that a SCH would by then have achieved with rapture; making rapture pretty useless to this argument. So your rapture means absolutely nothing. Also factor in WHM gets divine seal. So, in those 10 minutes, WHM gets a second cure.

And we're just talking cure IV's, which Cure V is much better than anyways. So in those 10 minutes, WHM gets to use 5 penurys and a divine seal. That comes out to an "additional" cure from divine seal and 2.5 from penury's. 3.5s more cures, not to mentiont he cure that the WHM would be doing is more efficient than the SCH's.

In addition to that, in order to keep up with the AoE status removal, SCH would have to use accession; WHM doesn't. Funny how that works; suddenly your raptures are totally gone if we're fighting anything worth a damn; also, at the same time, auspice is working in the WHM's favor by giving subtle blow, lessening the TP moves done in general.

Shall I keep going?

And yes, this was while forgetting cure cast time down gear.

I didn't mean that every WHM-specific spell was useless. I was saying SCH has spells that are equal to or better than most of them.

WHM has Afflatus Solace, which adds up to 300 points of Stoneskin to one target for 30 seconds or something. SCH has Stoneskinga which adds 350 Stoneskin to the whole party for 5 minutes.

WHM has Esuna, but also has to be hit by the AoE and then is still random on top of that. SCH can AoE any Status Removal spell, and be specific, without having to stand in AoE range.

Repose, while obviously having advantages over Sleep in certain situations, will generally not last as long as a Sleep II, and since SCH has Sleepga II, Graviga, and Bindga on top of just NQ Sleep II, SCH will still win in crowd control.

As for Fast Cast, SCH/RDM has -25% cast time off the top, with Fast Cast II trait and Light/Dark Arts. Then SCH has AF feet, for -5%, and Relic head, for another -5%, Loquacious Earring for -2%, and Royal Redingote for -5%. Total 42% Fast Cast, for every cure. SCH can also break the Fast Cast cap of 50% with Alacrity, if need be.

Your logic and math skills are probably much too complex for the troll at hand to understand how dumb he sounded when he made this thread.

Sch can remove 1 effect with their aoe spells.... while whm can remove nearly every effect at once. I haven't played my whm in a while, as i just got started back up being away a while, but i know misery esuna removes 3-5+ if not all effects simultaneously. Sch can never beat that.
Sch relies on its charges to be more efficient, but as the others have said, they're limited, and narrow. They allow you to cast most spells efficiently, but only for a few shots. Where whm has faster cast times and potency naturally, they also get the bonuses of your charges without expending this bonus speed or potency.

Repose lasts just as long as Sleep II, stop talking out of your ***.

Best thing ever: SCH can only do about 25% of that at any given time. Give it up, Ent; you're acting like SCH has full time Tabula Rasa mode on.

I have no doubt about the potential of SCH.

Just like the potential of Dancer mesmerizes me.

But for whatever reason either ppl do not have SCH or come other jobs to whatever events I do.

Just the same as for whatever reason me or anyone else cannot use our DNC in any situation because our other jobs are more understood and desirable.


All I know is my WHM is BOTH desirable AND powerful.

A good WHM makes runs solid, safe and win.

Could others jobs do the same? Likely.

Do they? Most of the time for a variety of reasons, no.

You do have to factor in the fact that basically everything you have listed above is dependent on your Strategems. In a high pressure scenario, you're gonna run out, and then what? A SCH isn't really a SCH if they're outta Strategems.

Also, take into account Stoneskin-ga requires not only you be close to the DD range, but has a significantly larger casttime versus just dropping an (albet) lower HP Stoneskin on a target through use of Afflatus Solace. Now, put the two together as a WHM/SCH (since regular SS overwrites Afflatus Solace-SS), and it can be quite potent at mitigating damage.

Also, consider that bouncing between -na spells and Sleep spells as a SCH will require Addendum, as well as a strat charge to put up Accession/Manifestion if you're trying to -ga it. Then there is grimoire recast. In high pressure situations, you'll potentially be stuck in one of the opposing Arts, and can't switch back. Or you'll be outta charges.

As I said before, it's a difference in playstyle. SCHs, as the class specifies, is a very tactical class, and you have to look very far ahead and consider all the possible scenarios to decide what's best to do next, and it is possible to lock yourself out of a role temporarily because of that.

How can you say SCH is limited by relying on Stratagems, right after you were saying it's logical to stand in AoE range and limit yourself by using Afflatus Misery instead of Solace?

Again, at no point did I say SCH is a better healer. For all the events I got to come to on SCH, I always assumed the role of a BLM, because there's like 5-8 healers present at all times anyway. Healing is definitely SCH's weak point.

/thread

I think the OP was just trying to say "It's even harder for Whm to get a party invite because Sch and Rdm are all the better."

Potency is not only on cure :

With a regen 2, a SCH will give 240 HP while a (good) whm will give 380 HP.

Same with bar-spell, whm have more magic def bonus on it (from ja and specific gears).
Same with tier 5 buffs like shellra 5, 24.2% for sch, until 27.34% for whm.

(Just to say that same name but not the same spell like you said)

Martyr is nice too when you need an instant cure or when you cant not do a normal cure (like if you dont have MP or if you are silenced).

Same with devotion to give MP to pld/other mages.


I dont say sch suck, but whm is specialised.



(Cure potency cap at 50% (pls stop post everywhere we can have more, on each new item with cure potency on it)

This is going nowhere as stated by everyone else here, you have no idea what you're talking about. Afflatus misery and solace doesn't limit a whitemage at all, they have what a 1 minute CD? If you're facing a mob that uses debuffs, switch to misery and debuff. We can still cure to nearly full potential, but we lose out on giving a stoneskin buff. Basically, its a Trade for a slight delay in stoneskin buff, for debuffing party. Going beyond this, whms now have aoe buffs as well do to level cap increase. So we can cast stoneskinga while staying in misery if we cared to. Scholar needs your charges to match a whms potential in healing, but we also have you're charges while remaining the best at what we do.

As Gael said whm is specialized, along with blm.
The sch can change its suit depending on the situation, but at any given time, can not beat either of those jobs in potency.

WHM may not conserve MP as good as a RDM or SCH but I'm sorry Ente I have to disagree with you 100% by having WHM and SCH to 75. My WHM can sleep just as long as Sleep II my cure V's have saved peoples *** a lot faster than my SCH's cures have. Sure, SCH has haste now. But I want to lol hard at saying barspells are useless. Not to mention the fact of Cure Clogs + Regen III....I just won't even get started

/tread.

You don't have to be standing next to a mob to make esuna effective! You guys have no creativity :P.

Aura Statues (Diorite Farming) in sky: Statue does Ice break [AoE Bind], WHM out of range... Divine seal + Erase works. If Divine Seal isn't up, here's what you do:

*Get in Esuna range
*Solace > Sacrafice anyone with status effect
*Misery > Esuna. Problem solved!

And that works with a lot of things other than Ice break. There is absolutely no problem with running in range for a second or two to tend to your party's ailments.

I agree with you willofflame, i mentioned that earlier. But it takes time to cast sacrifice, run in range, and then esuna. Its much more efficient to just stay within range and absorb them naturally, less the mob does decent aoe dmg or has silence, then either do you're strag, or manually debuff