MDB

Anyone know off hand what is the maximum bonus?

[EDIT: MDB = magic defense bonus, just in case people needed that cleared up]

You could get totally different totals for each job I'd suspect... Is there a particular one you're asking about?

I'm wondering if there's a MDB hardcap as there is for haste.

If there's a job in particular I'm asking about, it's PLD. I'm really just wondering if this item set is over the top and goes beyond the cap?

Ishkur from Garuda server had this thought posted in the Imponderable imponderables thread



I just wanted to see what other people thought

I believe 50% is the max MDB/- magical damage% you can reach. Then after that i go with elemental resist gear.

What are you trying to accomplish?

Just tweaking the gear set posted above. Really I'd rather put together and maintain a strong overall MDB set rather than have to multiple maintain elemental resist sets.

Ahh ok, well what i do is go for the MDB then toss in pieces that have multipul ele resit stats.

I tank RDM
Proro Ultima average CB 550-600 (some 900s that confuse me)
firga IV from the sky bird right around 350 doesnt break stoneskin most of the time(in alliance)
Genbu waterga IV solo damage to me does around 400 450 maybe 500 damage. Stoneskin eats most of the damage.
Kirin's Stonga i can survive dont remember exact numbers but it hurts something like 600 800 damage after going through my 350 stoneskin.(solo damage to me)

500-600 on Proto Ultima? I'm guessing because RDM has enhanced MDB job trait? What are you wearing/ using gearwise?

I say you should test it, since you have all that good gear :P
I wish I had avalon and I am still working on my Iron Ram Set (Sallet and Hands so far).
the first method that comes to mind is go ballista and have a BLM Elemental Seal (that makes it a sure land if I am not mistaken) and take a spell w/o the gear then try the same 10 mins later with all the gear...
you'll have a margin from the /random nature of dmg in FF but you'll get a good idea... I am sure there is a better method out there but yeah I am too lazy to think about it.

And on the gear posted above I'd change the askar feet for Iron Ram Greaves since it'll give MDB+3 (almost 3% less dmg taken) and having the whole set will give you +15 to all elements... and it'll have +3 enmity instead of +2

Now what other changes to make depend a lot on what the cap is, maybe change the Iron Ram Hose for W legs (since it gives +25 ele resistance to the most common needed elements) and you'd be capped anyways.

idk it all depends a lot on the cap. so we keep inquiring:

What's the cap ppl? =P

One reason why I'm asking about "the cap" is because using the gear set I featured, I ate back-to-back Citadel Busters for 900, then 1k DMG. Obviously I was spamming cure on myself in between.

If I knew what the cap was, then I could know for sure or not whether I could reduce the hit even further. If not I guess 900 is as low as I can make it as /NIN sub.

BTW good point about the Iron Ram Greaves, I hadn't thought of that. Since the body hasn't been released, full set = head, hands, legs, feet. I'm already wearing 3/4 so why not make 4/4 for full set. Then I could swap in some ELE resist stuff in the neck, belt, and ring slots.

Malekith you can check my gear sets to see what i use. I also have Stoneskin up so that eats 350 damage. So a SMN or BLU you could achieve the same damage reduction. If SMN or Blu stoneskin is 350 i am not sure.

As far as I can remember the cap for damage reduction (including Magic Defense Bonus gear) is 50% as was stated earlier... Anything further would be a waste so focusing on a specific resist set at that point would probably help your cause much more than MDB gear. Also you have to take into consideration that the reduction includes the presence of Shell (If a whm with capped Shellra V merits it would be approximately 27.34% and not is approximately 24.2%. Shell IV being about 21.9% otherwise, and Shell III being 18.8% if you just Shell yourself as a pld).

As far as the effects of magic defense bonus every +1 is just about 1% reduction (an increase of .01 from the base divisor of 1.00). A pld/rdm gets +10 MDB as a trait, whereas a pld/whm would get +12. Either way, the cap isn't too far off when you include shell. Since Pld/Nin on Ultima doesn't have any natural MDB, you could stack roughly +23 MDB (with capped Shell V), +26 (Uncapped Shell V) or about +31 (For your own Shell III) and reach the threshold where damage reduction caps. After that, you could do as I mentioned before and stack more light resistance. Resistance works separately from direct reduction so you could potentially lower the damage from citadel buster even further.

[EDIT: for quote from Khellendros, I edited to just show pertinent facts. Also since there is NO preview, I had to keep hitting post and edit. This was a lengthy post and do think some responded as I was between various drafts that I'd authored inbetween me pulling for a party out in Caederva Mire. Anywho all done now.]

Ok time for some math...

GIVEN:
Using this this item set on PLD/NIN gives me Magic damage taken = -17% & "Magic Def. Bonus" = +17



SO IF I understood correctly and got my math right, warning I'm a lawyer-to-be not an engineer here, I'd have 44.34 MDB from gear and Shell V... leaving me 5.66 below the cap.

Now IF I got hit with Citadel Buster at that point, FF would calculate how big of a resisted hit or not I'd take AND THEN it would do the damage calculation for the amount lessened by gear. It'd be a two step calculation before I finally saw how big of a hit I'd take.

Makes me wonder now IF I just found a way to add in that last 5.66% and added in light gears to help resist would that do better than having the -17% Magic damage taken. Really the idea of the set I built was to strike a balance, and having done so I know it's good for allowing me to take only 900-1K damage. I just want to see if I can reduce further or if what I've achieved is as good as it gets...

Really I'd like to hear from some other Paladin's out there who have tanked this bish...

resistance beyond the mdb cap is great. I've seen nin/drk take like 15dmg firaga 3 from tiamat. If toting around tons of elemntal resist isnt for you... i understand completely, its why i never got into the whole resistance build thing... even though i can make like 80% of the gears for them lol, its easier to just go blm than carry all that BS, lol

Math would go to:

With Capped Shell V - 27.34% + 17% + 17% = 61.34%, 11.34% over the cap
With Uncapped Shell V - 24.2% + 34% = 58.2%, 8.2% over the cap
With Shell IV - 21.9% + 34% = 55.9%
With Shell III - 18.8% + 34% = 52.8%

and etc. with the lesser amounts of Shell. Basically, if you have Shell III you're capped on the damage. Start stacking a little more elemental resistance and you're golden. If you have a Rdm or a merited Whm (which I would hope you do) you can remove some of the MDB or - magic damage gear for more resistance.

Just looking at the gear, I would suggest that you replace askar gambieras (only for this specific magic down set) with Iron Ram Greaves. It will give +3mdb AND increase your elemental resistance by +5 since you're using the other 3 pieces. That should bring your resistance to all elements to +30 if I'm not mistaken.

LoL... figures... I finish writting my big *** Post and Khell you write the response to what I was asking in advance, having seen where I was going with my thoughts anyways off the fragment that must have been posted as I was editing.

Much thanks... so basically I've learned that tMDB = ShellMDB + gearMDB + gearMR. It's a cummulative total then and not a two-step calculation like I had thought.

SO I guess going forward, definitely change the shoes. In an earlier post I had acknowledged that it was a good idea given that full set = 4 gears and I was already wearing 3/4. Aside from that if I know who's casting shell on me and to what extent it's merited I know I can swap out some of my resist/ reduction gear and plug in elemental stuff. The numbers you ran basically give me a cheat sheet now which will be helpful.

Wow theres some severe misinformation going on here. MDB does not equal -1% magic damage reduction. There is currently no known cap for MDB and a cap of -50% total magic damage reduction. If you had +50MDB and -50% magic damage taken you would take 33% of the base damage times the mobs MAB. Therefore it is best to first stack -% Magic damage taken till you hit the 50% cap and then MDB in other slots. Never sacrifice -% damage for MDB if you aren't currently capped, and for the most part if you are stacking elemental resistance gear you need around 300 total with songs or barspells to get a worthwhile "resist" rate.

If you aren't sure what the hell I'm saying heres a link to a BG thread which is a lot better than some of the stuff people are saying here.

http://www.bluegartrls.com/forum/ffxi-standard-discussion/60326-mdb-magic-cap-question.html

[Edit: reposted Tanith's link on-click to save C/P]

See that's what I thought when I first built my set... time to go looking on BG then...

http://www.bluegartrls.com/forum/ffxi-standard-discussion/60326-mdb-magic-cap-question.html

Thanks for the input Tanith.

Keep in mind kith, a ele staff offers GREAT resistance to a given/opposite element. If buster is fire based, knowing you got like half hour to equip gear when your countdown begins. Swap to the opposite staff, right there is +20 using HQ version and only toting 1 item to boot. I know it doesnt sound fun, and it isn't, but I am a victim of holding 62 pieces of gear on me at all times to do the BLM thing. It sucks I know. Does it help? You tell me man, you've been my PLD =). What I'm trying to say is this. Knowing the fight prior you can bring specific resistance gear opposed to toting around a mule to trade the gear mid fight cause you don't got room. As far as stacks go and how much. I don't know, I stun them crazy things that may blow me to bits ;P

Elemental Resistance - "Resistance is the weakening of the effect of a magical attack due to natural or aided elemental resistance. When a magical attack occurs, the game makes a random check of the Magic Accuracy of the attack against the target's resistance to determine how much the attack is resisted."

A few pieces of gear that helps are Crimson Greaves/Cuisses which give +20 Ele resist and a few other nice bonus stats. Also, Assault Breastplate gives +15 Ele resist (if you can afford it).

MDB is nice, but that item set you provided, Male, is pretty much all you can get up to. I'd say stack up as much as you can, but make sure to have some really good Ele resist pieces, they really do help with the magic damage.

Citadel Buster is non-elemental Magic Damage

As for other mobs, like land-kings, Cerby, Jorgy etc... I understand the need for the 300+ ele set. By creating this thread I wanted to accomplish 2 things:

1) Get feedback on that set's efficacy as it pertained to Proto-Ultima

2) See what people knew/ thought with respect to my attempt to use that same set on other magic spamming HNM.

I am NO fan of carrying around 67/70 gear. I'm a minimalist.... and while much as I'd like to reinvent the wheel here it can't be done. My humble goal would be for this set would enable a PLD to take a shot, live through it, and over the course of a fight enable the supporting healers to extend their MP. Since I wouldn't be "nuked" as hard, I wouldn't need as much cures, and we'd all be better for it...

Tan's link results.

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So then are we to now try to figure out, is buster a magical dmg or physical dmg? Does it check defense values or ignore them on the given attack magic/physical.

**Add Don't ask me how, whole alliance was floored and we all lmfao about it. I was the buster target, protect 2/shell 2/blink/stoneskin. Got drawn in and waited patiently to kiss my *** good-bye. Somehow it missed or did 0 dmg. Blinkable? I doubt it. But don't quote me. Also this was eons ago, vague memory. I could have taken dmg but I do remember the big laugh/discussion we had the I walked away from it alive.

Citadel buster is a magical attack, thats why stacking -% magic damage gear reduces it, additionally fealty gives a higher chance for you to resist the spell similar to the use of fealty on meteor and mijin gakure.

Went back and fixed it, should work now

Yea good reading. Props Tan.

Tan's link is good to read.
May explain why i dont like the Goliard's set Vs Proto-ultima or just my lack of testing.
On wiki can't find much info cept MDB almost equal to - magic damage.

Thanks for the link Tan.

Salient point Tanith, and actually I do do that... thing is the way my merit build for PLD is set up , Fealty is a one trick poney for me. I only invested one merit, so I can use it at start and then it's a 20 min recast. Normally with Ultima we're either dead inside of 10 minutes or it's a win and I'll be 2:00 to recast.

Fealty is amazing in that situation though, because it has the ability to negate the dmg from certain non-elemental sources of damage. Citadel Buster certainly falls under that category...

This may get me flamed HARDCORE. But here goes. Mind is also MDB (non flame statement) As well its MAD. Magic attack down. This isn't something I wiki. It's to my own personal experience using various gear mods that mind does in fact lower MAB. Again personal thought, personal preference. Let me believe this one lol. But mind is in fact MDB at what calculation, TAN!!! hook up the answer =)

MND has no impact in calculating magic damage taken, however for the most part a lot of enfeebles have a dmnd or dint involved in potency that take account for the duration/strength of enfeebles.

Via Wiki.

A stat that determines the effectiveness of Healing Magic spells, White Magic Enhancing Magic spells and White Magic Enfeebling Magic spells, and is thought to have an impact on a character's Magical Resistance. Again personal experience testing various gears, this "thought" seems true. Example. GA lands on whole party. Magically WHM takes ALOT less dmg than everyone else w/ same shellV stoneskin mods. Now I understand other variables. Maybe they were midcast with proper negating staff equipt. Again. Just a personal experience/ personal preference. I'm not trying to flame or argue, just enlighten Kith as much s possible on the subject. =) Sorry if does "seem" like I disagree. Just a personal experience.