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[Thief] Some Information on Bully
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サーバ: Siren
Game: FFXI
Posts: 14552
Bismarck.Danz
サーバ: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 688
By Bismarck.Danz 2011-08-22 12:35:31
still in development? why do i have a feeling this update is going to be uber late -.-;
Edit* it is! by a whole month. /shocker. oh well it was expected. time to grind away for another month
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 996
By Asura.Kaisuko 2011-08-22 12:36:34
So it's like an unspecified x-circle effect? Making the original x-circle effects less relevant than they are now? lol
Sylph.Seriin
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 84
By Sylph.Seriin 2011-08-22 13:07:18
The circle moves still have their place (lol) in that they are used specifically against certain mob types and get other bonuses beyond the intimidate.
It certainly isn't going to hurt to use it.. and most of the time you have a thief around anyway for TH.. That being said it does seem a little bit of an odd ability.
By Kalima 2011-08-22 14:40:06
At least they admitted it will work on Nms which is much more than I expected. I also expect that the THF will probably need the mob to face him and that it wont interrupt anything major like spells or tp moves.
Guess we will have to wait and see...
Phoenix.Kirana
サーバ: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2025
By Phoenix.Kirana 2011-08-22 14:44:25
If the duration is indeed as short as conspirator, this ability sounds even more useless than I had originally thought. Hopefully the ability that compliments SATA will at least be useful, whatever is is...
By Artemicion 2011-08-22 14:56:28
I never understood why Thief got Bully, since the primary function and emphasis of the ability is to intimidate.
I don't see a class that thrives in feint or stealth like attacks to fool monsters and divert enmity while dishing out stabby goodness, has any sort of front line intimidation capacity.
I understand Thief would be a "bully" in the sense of being relentless with their swift knife attacks, but frankly I don't see this as a sort of war face intimidation sort of thing belonging to thief.
If anything, it belongs to (based strictly on being conducive to a particular class) Warrior.
A cool idea is to make Bully a job trait that applies when using Warcry.
That seems to make a lot more sense in the logical aspect.
Ifrit.Arawn
サーバ: Ifrit
Game: FFXI
Posts: 546
By Ifrit.Arawn 2011-08-22 15:30:18
Why do I get the feeling that the developers have a list of ideas on a large dart board. They choose two darts at random each with a random job on them. Then they throw the darts at the board and voila; job adjustments.
Leviathan.Draylo
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
By Leviathan.Draylo 2011-08-22 15:35:10
THF needs more group utility in the form of enhancing drops/items and gil. They need to be able to steal more things, I never used THF in past FF's unless I wanted additional treasure.
サーバ: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 11680
By Fenrir.Nightfyre 2011-08-22 15:39:47
I never understood why Thief got Bully, since the primary function and emphasis of the ability is to intimidate.
I don't see a class that thrives in feint or stealth like attacks to fool monsters and divert enmity while dishing out stabby goodness, has any sort of front line intimidation capacity.
I understand Thief would be a "bully" in the sense of being relentless with their swift knife attacks, but frankly I don't see this as a sort of war face intimidation sort of thing belonging to thief.
If anything, it belongs to (based strictly on being conducive to a particular class) Warrior. Mug?
By Artemicion 2011-08-22 15:44:24
I never understood why Thief got Bully, since the primary function and emphasis of the ability is to intimidate.
I don't see a class that thrives in feint or stealth like attacks to fool monsters and divert enmity while dishing out stabby goodness, has any sort of front line intimidation capacity.
I understand Thief would be a "bully" in the sense of being relentless with their swift knife attacks, but frankly I don't see this as a sort of war face intimidation sort of thing belonging to thief.
If anything, it belongs to (based strictly on being conducive to a particular class) Warrior. Mug?
I see what you're getting at, but Mug was used in the context of taking currency rather than "stealing" one's valuables, despite the definition of mug being to assault viciously, often with the intention of taking one's money.
Bully still doesn't quite seem conducive to the deceptive nature of Thief. If anything, Flee solidifies the stance that they're swift, agile, money hungry go getters and keen on trickery and backstabbing more so than being up front, personal and intimidating.
Asura.Vyre
Forum Moderator
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15393
By Asura.Vyre 2011-08-22 15:48:53
I never understood why Thief got Bully, since the primary function and emphasis of the ability is to intimidate. I don't see a class that thrives in feint or stealth like attacks to fool monsters and divert enmity while dishing out stabby goodness, has any sort of front line intimidation capacity. I understand Thief would be a "bully" in the sense of being relentless with their swift knife attacks, but frankly I don't see this as a sort of war face intimidation sort of thing belonging to thief. If anything, it belongs to (based strictly on being conducive to a particular class) Warrior. Mug? I see what you're getting at, but Mug was used in the context of taking currency rather than "stealing" one's valuables, despite the definition of mug being to assault viciously, often with the intention of taking one's money. Bully still doesn't quite seem conducive to the deceptive nature of Thief. If anything, Flee solidifies the stance that they're swift, agile, money hungry go getters and keen on trickery and backstabbing more so than being up front, personal and intimidating. Well for what's it worth, an old definition of the word bully is, "Someone hired to commit violent acts."
Bismarck.Helel
サーバ: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1335
By Bismarck.Helel 2011-08-22 15:49:26
Bully is clearly a BST ability. This JA makes absolutely no sense, just like Bounty Shot makes absolutely no sense for RNG. That said, I'm not complaining about either ability, they just don't make sense for their associated jobs.
By Kalima 2011-08-22 15:49:40
I never understood why Thief got Bully, since the primary function and emphasis of the ability is to intimidate.
I don't see a class that thrives in feint or stealth like attacks to fool monsters and divert enmity while dishing out stabby goodness, has any sort of front line intimidation capacity.
I understand Thief would be a "bully" in the sense of being relentless with their swift knife attacks, but frankly I don't see this as a sort of war face intimidation sort of thing belonging to thief.
If anything, it belongs to (based strictly on being conducive to a particular class) Warrior.
I actually thought the same thing, this JA doesn't really seem THF like...you would think mobs would be more scared of the dude with the big effin G axe instead of the guy with two tiny daggers. On the other hand...this is SE logic we're talking about...
I would even say switch THFs new JA with DNC while changing both. Give THF a new triple attack JA that crits all hits on a 2-3 min timer and stacks with WSs while giving DNC an intimdate move that works with sambas.
Sylph.Kiaru
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 681
By Sylph.Kiaru 2011-08-22 15:53:39
Trying to figure out why exactly THF need an ability like this to help them out........
yeah, not seeing it, can SE stop adding RANDOM *** abilities that don't actually help the jobs become better? WTF?
They seriously need to start adding abilities that help jobs out instead of picking them out of a hat :/
Quote: THF needs more group utility in the form of enhancing drops/items and gil. They need to be able to steal more things, I never used THF in past FF's unless I wanted additional treasure.
Yeah, they need more hate control and more ways to make mobs drop crap or to steal crap or to take gil etc. You know, things that would actually help the job...................
Another reason this ability makes no sense is because if you're using a THF TANK he/she can't proc TH very well due to not being able to SA and TA :/ Not to mention the fact THF gets TA which is a way to PLACE HATE ONTO OTHER PEOPLE WTF WTF WTF?
Unless I'm wrong and it's castable on other players, then that's cool :x Still random and dumb though.
サーバ: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 23653
By Shiva.Flionheart 2011-08-22 15:55:50
THF needs more group utility in the form of enhancing drops/items and gil. They need to be able to steal more things, I never used THF in past FF's unless I wanted additional treasure.
I always wanted steal to enhance the TH level.
Or an ability called "Dislodge" or something on a five minute timer, that enhances the TH level by one.
By Alaik 2011-08-22 15:57:02
inb4 5% activation rate on NMs, 5 minute recast and 30 second duration.
By Artemicion 2011-08-22 16:00:45
I'd start by reducing the recast of Accomplice. It's very effective, but 5 minutes is heafty for having Collaborator on a one minute recast and being 50% as effective.
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Sylph.Kiaru
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 681
By Sylph.Kiaru 2011-08-22 16:01:35
I'd start by reducing the recast of Accomplice. It's very effective, but 5 minutes is heafty for having Collaborator on a one minute recast and being 50% as effective. That'd be nice, I never use accomplice because of its long recast and the fact it shares a recast with collab :(
By Artemicion 2011-08-22 16:03:30
It just seems strange to have this projected image or "vision" as they put it, of thief being a support damage dealer that redirects enmity constructively to help keep damage dealers on an even foundation then keep the only tools in that aspect limited, and instead give them intimidation but no boost for dishing out damage or tools to redirect enmity? At least they're not the 1% TH pokers like they used to be.
サーバ: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1255
By Shiva.Khimaira 2011-08-22 16:04:11
THF needs more group utility in the form of enhancing drops/items and gil. They need to be able to steal more things, I never used THF in past FF's unless I wanted additional treasure.
I always wanted steal to enhance the TH level.
Or an ability called "Dislodge" or something on a five minute timer, that enhances the TH level by one.
Horribad name, but not a bad idea. SE would make it with like a 90% chance of failure, but meh, it's better than nothing.
サーバ: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 23653
By Shiva.Flionheart 2011-08-22 16:06:25
They should really make new steal abilities. A steal move that takes a random move from the mob for 30 seconds (So they can't use it, not so you can use it). on a 2 minute timer or something.
Being able to steal STR, DEX, AGI, etc wouldn't be too bad either if it was potent enough.
By Artemicion 2011-08-22 16:08:26
Well for what's it worth, an old definition of the word bully is, "Someone hired to commit violent acts."
That's true, but I suppose the definition has waned over the past 6 decades or so to something a little more like this, which I still can't see thief living up to.
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By Artemicion 2011-08-22 16:10:33
They should really make new steal abilities. A steal move that takes a random move from the mob for 30 seconds (So they can't use it, not so you can use it). on a 2 minute timer or something.
Being able to steal STR, DEX, AGI, etc wouldn't be too bad either if it was potent enough.
Would be nice if they simply divorced Aura Steal from the Steal ability in of itself. It bugged me when I tried to nab an item and I got a buff from the mob instead D:
Though I like your idea of how thief can hinder the mob without having a confrontational aspect to it. They are meant to be vicious backstabbers after all.
サーバ: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 16303
By Ramuh.Sagittario 2011-08-22 16:12:05
Depending on the activation rate of the intimidation effect, this could have it's uses against TP spam NMs, but I'm not expecting much.
Sylph.Kiaru
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 681
By Sylph.Kiaru 2011-08-22 16:12:14
Aura steal should be seperate on a MUCH lower CD imo. I only use steal to steal buffs now cause taking items has a 99.99% chance of not working...so useless ._.
By Artemicion 2011-08-22 16:14:15
You know, Thief is pretty effective in marksmanship skill.
It would be neat if they introduced some more status ailment bolts and gave thief something to enhance their potency and/or duration.
Just a thought. Brainstorming right now.
Leviathan.Draylo
サーバ: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
By Leviathan.Draylo 2011-08-22 16:15:58
They should really make new steal abilities. A steal move that takes a random move from the mob for 30 seconds (So they can't use it, not so you can use it). on a 2 minute timer or something.
Being able to steal STR, DEX, AGI, etc wouldn't be too bad either if it was potent enough.
Yeah that would be good, I think it would be cool also if thief could steal special items that can be used vs the NM. Like being able to steal an item that locks a ws like you said or you can use to mix with ingredients and make a grenade or something lol, like rikku in FFX.
サーバ: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 23653
By Shiva.Flionheart 2011-08-22 16:19:28
They should really make new steal abilities. A steal move that takes a random move from the mob for 30 seconds (So they can't use it, not so you can use it). on a 2 minute timer or something.
Being able to steal STR, DEX, AGI, etc wouldn't be too bad either if it was potent enough.
Yeah that would be good, I think it would be cool also if thief could steal special items that can be used vs the NM. Like being able to steal an item that locks a ws like you said or you can use to mix with ingredients and make a grenade or something lol, like rikku in FFX.
Yeah that would be pretty awesome
It wouldn't actually be too hard to code either, just make each mob family have a special item that you get as a temp until the mob is dead, and using that item Enfeebles them in a way beneficial and unattainable by other jobs
The whole mix thing would be cool, or just make items more effective on thf and make it so they have like 3 temps get refunded into their items every 2 mins or something. (I've given up on the chance of there being a chemist job after all D:)
サーバ: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 16303
By Ramuh.Sagittario 2011-08-22 16:24:04
They should really make new steal abilities. A steal move that takes a random move from the mob for 30 seconds (So they can't use it, not so you can use it). on a 2 minute timer or something. Being able to steal STR, DEX, AGI, etc wouldn't be too bad either if it was potent enough. Yeah that would be good, I think it would be cool also if thief could steal special items that can be used vs the NM. Like being able to steal an item that locks a ws like you said or you can use to mix with ingredients and make a grenade or something lol, like rikku in FFX.
NO.
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