Presidental Debate One

Where is the proof that people aren't networking or communicating their jobskills, or trying to develop new ones with the government assistance they are recieving? I'll be honest and blunt: Your depiction of the average person on welfare is rather skewed at best. In fact, it's down right insulting. Opportunity only exists for so long, and to so many people. Even with dirty degrading jobs, you have to think about how many people are applying for those jobs. Say you have 500 job openings in one city, which has an unemployed populous of over 4,000 people. What about the other 3500 people that still need that assistance?
Many of these people already offer volunteer services just to pass the time until other opportunities open up, but they still need basic utilities and necessities to live reasonably safe, so they can live long enough for the next possibility of a job.

You chastise these people as being lazy, when in fact, they probably work harder than the average joe with a job, simply because they need it. Welfare checks only give out so much money to live on, that barely covers rent, food, clothing, and other necessities.

Also, if you're that worried about these people being lazy, look at how many people recieving assistance end up taking courses to develop new skills, or learn how to remarket their current skills. Another option would be to teach the so-called lazy welfare bums how to get a job, despite all the unprofessional attitudes of interviewers, and the misguided notion that "it's a gift" to not work for those people.

And yet you feel the need to be critical of his opinion, Triple Standard!

nonsense, the evidence mounts as high as our national debt!

o wait, that is some of the evidence...

But you know it would be no fun if we all just agreed right?

Yes, I do know.

Oh, ***.

Spoken like someone who can't even criticize their own party. You been asleep during the last 8 years of Republican activity or should I fire up the Powerpoint and show you those WMD sites again?


Anecdoooooooooootes. They mean all of ***. Sorry if you've closed your eyes to reality and have constructed your own. Perhaps you should check out some Glenn Beck or Rush Limbaugh who happen to be strong pillars of the conservative movement and draw millions of viewers/listeners? Oh right, you're still telling yourselves that conservatives are hard workers while liberals don't work!

I wish I could process things in such a dualistic fashion.


Check out the income inequality gap. You might find something interesting in there.


Pay to work is already part of the welfare system, unemployment benefits aren't a handout, your own party perpetuates the scenarios that lead to "people on the system" and you're so dishonest not to acknowledge it. NO ABORTIONS comes with consequences my friend and it involves spinning the wheel of welfare.

Shall we just gut welfare entirely? Maybe that'll solve the issue. Those filthy subhumans will learn to work or die in the streets in squalor. The very thought of such an America has given me quite the erection... winners and losers but more importantly than that I can take solace in knowing that with each step up the social ladder my opponents are utterly and completely annihilated. Feels good man.


A common misdirection tactic designed to turn the middle class against the poor.

The rich are getting richer and through the concerted actions of a few all of the nets and perks that came with being middle class are being crushed under the heel of free market hoopla that you're willing to eat up while they drink wine laughing at your idiocy. Crush those unions, torpedo those benefits, increase working hours but not accordingly with the wages all while corporate welfare becomes a staple in our market.

Keep waiting for that trickle down though, it's coming any decade now.

Oh, lets not even go into the attack on college benefits either. We can't pay for Pell Grants but we can pay for that bloated military budget? Some priorities we have.

But what else would I expect from Creationists? Gotta fight those ME wars to open the portal for ancient prophecy to be fulfilled!

Angry much? You need a hug?

Angry? I don't get angry on forums my friend. Spirited? Perhaps.

Judging by the size of the erection you got from getting off on my post, I'd say spirited is one way to put it.

Oh, anti-intellectualism...

As for the healthcare issue under the constitution, is it not one of the greatest points that all American Citizens have the right to Life and Liberty?

If that's true, wouldn't privatizing healthcare negate both aspects by limiting one's right to essential life-saving healthcare?

Having Universal Access to healthcare should be everyone's liberty, not just to those that can afford it.

^This X 875,000

That and by the time I go to post five or six pages have zoomed past and the moment is gone. I need to hire me one of these kids that post in sixteen threads at once to be my forum secretary.

It would help if your name is parker so I can yell at you like J. Jonah Jameson.

(could have used you right there to look up the correct spelling of jonah)

It's Johnathan Jonah Jameson, or something like that. Atleast in the old 1990's tv series he let it slip what his first name was, since the name was given to his son.

The ACA is privatized healthcare and people are creating boogymen out of a law that while not universal healthcare did well to address some of the issues that were present and has been liked by both sides of the political spectrum. Romney on stage agreeing with the President on the provisions alone should be telling to both sides.

Obamacare is only in play because the Republicans want to decapitate the president and trash his greatest achievement. It's less about the American people and more about a grudge match to undo everything then reinstall the same ***at the cost of taxpayer dollars but to placate constituents who can't accept anything put forth by Obama.

But who gives a ***about tax dollars when it will crush the opposition?

Who gives a ***about truthful information to dissuade the rumors and lies put forth by fearmongering skeptics? It's obviously a blatant attempt to wholeheartedly lie to push an agenda which helps the majority of citizens.

Yep can't wait to see how ohio votes.

69% of Cleveland residents are functionally illiterate
Some Cleveland neighborhoods have an illiteracy rate as high as 95%

Sources: Center for Urban Poverty and Social Change, Mandel School of Applied Social Sciences, Case Western Reserve University; National Assessment of Adult Literacy, Ohio Literacy Resource Center

http://www.seedsofliteracy.org/index.php/facts/

What color state are we again!? /drool It's all purpley! /hippy sitar music

I wondered out loud the other day how long it would be before John Kasic (Rep. Gov Ohio), who is working like twenty ***, figured out all his hard work to bring jobs into Ohio will have the unintended consequences of re-electing Obama. That and he bears a weird resemblance to Benny Urquidez

http://www.ccsu.edu/page.cfm?p=11096

this site begs to differ saying Cleveland is the #13th literate city in the USA.

Again you circumvented my question. You seem to be doing that lot with my points. What about switching jobs? Providers have contracts with employers. You cannot always keep the same provider once you voluntarily leave your employer. So please save me the "you allocated your unemployment check incorrectly" argument.

Additionally, you need to get out of this survival of the fittest mentality. There are epidemiological repercussions, to not providing everyone in a population healthcare. (E.g. I inoculate 10 people with a bacterial infection. I only treat one individual in that group of 10. Those 10 who are in contact, then reinfect the one that has been treated. Over the course of time, evolution intervenes, and you now have a drug resistant strain- in layman's terms your costing the guy who can pay for health coverage more money by not providing health coverage to the others). Basic epidemiology and public health science my friend.

Case vs csu... hmmm that's like comparing Harvard to phoenix online.

Question: Can you find valid proof that Case actually said "Cleveland is 69% literate"?

Google shows nothing of that sort. IT only links to that .org site and nothing else.

I prefer not to listen to these dumb .org sites seeing as they tend to misinform and take things out of context.

For instance:
http://www.dhmo.org/

By Brent Larkin, The Plain Dealer

http://www.cleveland.com/opinion/index.ssf/2012/03/awful_literacy_stats_make_the.html

You are shifting the blame to the "lazy" while at the same time denouncing those who would place some responsibility on the growing wealth gap. I wasn't even arguing your point. The welfare queen boogeyman has been around for longer than I have and to this day is not worth arguing against. I was just pointing out the hypocrisy of your statement.

But I guess I'm just a mean ol' liberal...

News sites often stretch the story too, and he didn't give any type of proof of it. Looking thru http://povertycenter.cwru.edu/ this site right now, that was linked but not to a specific article.

edit:

I see nothing here about illiteracy.

I did, after a few minutes of going thru Google links, find one thing they did on illiteracy... back in 2004

And with the 69% thing, it says
http://digitalcase.case.edu:9000/fedora/get/ksl:miklit00/miklit00.pdf

Sparth changed his avatar ; ;

Sure, I made that statement based on what I see, hear, read, and have experienced. And since I said that, it's obviously beyond my ability and attention span to list everything that the government does, and compare it to other countries, or to private equivalents - I could work on one thing for months and months and still not be able to "prove it." Also, other people surely have had different personal experiences as well as different standards when it comes to saying what a "good job" is.

For example (made up,) I could say that 40% percent of the bridges in the country have not been maintained according to their maintenance schedules, and that 20% are structurally deficient. I might say that every bridge needs to be maintained properly, and that this is bad. Someone else might say that there's no problem until bridges actually start collapsing.

I have no doubt that hardworking, responsible, honest people exist in our government. And I actually enjoy seeing and evaluating all kinds of things in order to expand my understanding of it. But so far, the "bad job" category is winning. If anyone has, for the most part, only experienced efficient and responsible government behavior, then congratulations to them. I would absolutely prefer that to be my experience as well.

But really, are you actually satisfied with the efficiency and quality of our government?

I really enjoyed the way you put this. Very well played and in your face healthcare haters.

Public forum, yo. If your opinions can't stand up to valid criticism, then maybe they weren't worth making.

My state has laws preventing insurance carriers from rejecting you based on pre-existing conditions if you are simply switching providers due to a job change. Why do we need to have the feds do something that's clearly capable of occurring on a state level?

Except that the ACA doesn't provide for just basic inoculations and vaccines, it wants me to pay for plans that include abortive services and birth control and a whole ton of ***that goes far beyond what is required to prevent the basic spread of disease.