The Parthenon: A Warrior's Kyklos
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フォーラム » FFXI » Jobs » Warrior » The Parthenon: A Warrior's Kyklos
The Parthenon: A Warrior's Kyklos
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 Asura.Cambion
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By Asura.Cambion 2021-05-24 23:38:38
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Yzen said: »
@Cambion
#Public-Fan-Crush lol :P
I would definitely welcome your LUA to help teach me [and whoever else delving into this game] how to further refine my own -- especially the gearsets -- My research also let me know that you put a lot of time and effort into helping out the community [ie: your gearswap guide with your DNC as an example] Nothing but gratitude! /bow

Just a reminder, my lua's ar ebased on Gearinfo for Haste Tiers. These only matter for dual wielding, and I don't know why anyone wouldn't want to use gearinfo for haste detection, but here's the lua. 5 tiers of DT swaps, 3 tiers of acc swaps, 5 weapon swaps, 2 idle sets and the warp/tele ring/RR ear/head quick toggle.
Spoiler Alert! Click to view.

Since I'm here, I've been playing with the DPS sheet and min/maxing for the Lvl 15 Bumba fight.

The common answer I get is 'just 5/5 Sakpata' but I'm a loser who enjoys playing with DPS sheets, arguably more than actually fighting the NM. Anyways, I wanted to propose 2 sets and see how you guys felt.
Basics: This is a fully buffed scenario. Soul Voice Bard 5 songs, Sam/Drk Roll Cor, Bolster Fury/Precision, food, no sub(nin), yadda yadda.

I've only been working on War for a week since I returned for the free campaign, but, as mentioned the current thesis is just wear full 5/5 Sakpata for these types of scenarios where risk is involved. Full Sakpata is 38 DT, and TP cape is 10 PDT, for 48%.

I went through each piece of gear to calculate which resulted in the largest DPS drop from (what I currently believe) to be our best 'Full Send' TP set, and then adjusted by adding Sakpata to the lowest DPS returning slots, and finding a way to cap DT in alternate slots with the least DPS loss.



On the right is the 5/5 Sakpata, with the best TP set I could find. (My WS sets aren't calculating Aug Nyame yet, because that's the intent of this test)

On the left is the alternate Hybrid set I was able to calculate.
Loricate (6), D Ring(10), Vocane(7), Sakpata Legs(9), Sakpata Hands(8), 40DT + Cape 10PDT = 50%

I've just started testing the set, so no meaningful feedback for survival yet, but just wanted to see what more experienced warriors thought, or were using, etc?
 Bahamut.Atigeve
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By Bahamut.Atigeve 2021-05-24 23:57:40
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Nvm I see it now
 Elikins
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By Elikins 2021-05-25 03:19:16
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I've been looking through the pages, looking for even a semi upto date Mighty Strikes set for Upheaval/Reso/Savage, what would one look like with the current gear sets available? Thanks.
 Devaraja
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By Devaraja 2021-05-25 17:37:46
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Elikins said: »
I've been looking through the pages, looking for even a semi upto date Mighty Strikes set for Upheaval/Reso/Savage, what would one look like with the current gear sets available? Thanks.

ItemSet 379947

This is the best combo I could find for Upheaval. The belt just barely ekes out fotia. For Savage, +2 neck and Sailfi Belt is better. And for Reso fotia.

edit: That was with brazen rush active as well, so +2 neck is better without.
 Icydeath
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By Icydeath 2021-06-06 17:40:52
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@Spaitin

Hows the WAR gear guide shaping up? Excited to see what you have, even if its only partially done.
 Fenrir.Richybear
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By Fenrir.Richybear 2021-06-06 18:15:19
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Spaitsui here!
Please look forward to it
[+]
 Spaitin
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By Spaitin 2021-06-07 10:00:52
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it is coming along. a lot slower than I originally promised (sorry). but i have not forgot. been really busy lately
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 Bahamut.Speedycat
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By Bahamut.Speedycat 2021-06-08 11:41:49
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I don't know who this frog is but I appreciate his dedication to war things
 Lakshmi.Buukki
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2021-06-08 11:54:10
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Devaraja said: »
Elikins said: »
I've been looking through the pages, looking for even a semi upto date Mighty Strikes set for Upheaval/Reso/Savage, what would one look like with the current gear sets available? Thanks.

ItemSet 379947

This is the best combo I could find for Upheaval. The belt just barely ekes out fotia. For Savage, +2 neck and Sailfi Belt is better. And for Reso fotia.

edit: That was with brazen rush active as well, so +2 neck is better without.

I have Fatality Belt on my mule and had no idea what the hell it actually did (the latent trigger, lol). Random Gobbie box item. Is it worth using this over R15 sailfi +1 though? That's probably not ideal, but it's what I have been using. I have been using a DM WSD+10 Valorous Greaves for flex, but Boii is probably still better for MS.
 
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 Asura.Brennski
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By Asura.Brennski 2021-06-18 03:53:18
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schere earring rather than Cessance would get more ACC when it's fully augged.
 SimonSes
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By SimonSes 2021-06-18 04:50:56
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Aurgelmir Orb +1 is upgrade too. Same acc, but with better stp/str/att.

NVM you need Seething Bomblet R15 anyway. Not only it has much higher acc, but will also cap haste.
 
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 Asura.Kronikx
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By Asura.Kronikx 2021-06-18 09:07:58
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Serjero said: »
We are assuming nerfed geomancy (Gaol mostly). But yeah, if geomancy isn't nerfed chaos roll is useless.

I was under the impression that only the Geomancy debuff (bubbles on mobs) took the nerf. That Geomancy player buffs were mostly uneffected.
 SimonSes
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By SimonSes 2021-06-18 10:08:37
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kusaregedo77 said: »
chango + utu will be a significant boost too when i get those.

For Wave 3? It probably wont lol. Chango is only better when you solo fight 1 mob and multistep self skillchain.
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 SimonSes
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By SimonSes 2021-06-18 10:36:50
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kusaregedo77 said: »
while you're here what does a resolution set look like nowadays? i don't like the idea of using argosy unless it's a huge gain.

I only know that 5/5 Sakpata's is a huge boost to Reso for capped attack, but I havent ever checked Reso for uncapped attack sorry XD
 Phoenix.Capuchin
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By Phoenix.Capuchin 2021-06-22 18:59:36
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Well aware I'm very late to reply to this, but...

Asura.Cambion said: »
Full Sakpata is 38 DT, and TP cape is 10 PDT, for 48%.

I went through each piece of gear to calculate which resulted in the largest DPS drop from (what I currently believe) to be our best 'Full Send' TP set, and then adjusted by adding Sakpata to the lowest DPS returning slots, and finding a way to cap DT in alternate slots with the least DPS loss.

Full Sakpata is 40 DT, not 38. 7+10+8+9+6

I tend to prefer just sticking DT-5% on back and using Moonlight/Niq for rings. Capped DT with minimal impact on offense. The slight DPS difference from losing Petrov's DA+1% & attribute+3 is WELL worth it to me, when Moonlight gives you the same STP and Acc/Atk+8 along with significantly better defensive perks (not just the DT-5%, but also HP+110 and no Enm+5 that you probably don't want). And no need to use any other slots aside from Sakpata, Cape, and 1 ring for DT-50%.

Also, your TP1 set mistakenly shows two D.Rings. Or if that's not a mistake, please teach me how to wear two of 'em :)

EDIT:
Also, if using DA+10 augment on cape, your 5/5 Sakpata TP set is already over 100% DA without rings, making the DA on Petrov useless and actually a worse choice than Moonlight (or other options like Chirich +1), even if focused solely on DPS. So be aware you'd need to be using STP cape augment or something to even have that ring choice make any sense.

WAR traits/gifts (master)/merits: DA+33%
Sakpata 5/5: DA+30%
Cape: DA+10%
Ammo: DA+3%
Neck R25: DA+7%
Brutal/Schere: DA+11%
Ioskeha +1: DA+9%
------
Total: DA+103%
[+]
 Asura.Failaras
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By Asura.Failaras 2021-06-23 11:01:44
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So I haven't started gearing Warrior yet but am very interested in it and had two questions:

1) Would the gear sets on page 1 be a good starting point for Non-Sakpata owners? It looks like it is a little out dated but I'm not sure how far off it is as a jumping off point for a newer Warrior.

2) The only job I have geared right now is Samurai and I've seen Sailfi+1 augmented pushed over Ioskeha +1 for that job, why is Ioskeha +1 better for Warrior? Is it because of the DA damage on JSE cape or something else?
 Cerberus.Shadowmeld
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By Cerberus.Shadowmeld 2021-06-23 17:01:35
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Phoenix.Capuchin said: »
Well aware I'm very late to reply to this, but...

Asura.Cambion said: »
Full Sakpata is 38 DT, and TP cape is 10 PDT, for 48%.

I went through each piece of gear to calculate which resulted in the largest DPS drop from (what I currently believe) to be our best 'Full Send' TP set, and then adjusted by adding Sakpata to the lowest DPS returning slots, and finding a way to cap DT in alternate slots with the least DPS loss.

Full Sakpata is 40 DT, not 38. 7+10+8+9+6

I tend to prefer just sticking DT-5% on back and using Moonlight/Niq for rings. Capped DT with minimal impact on offense. The slight DPS difference from losing Petrov's DA+1% & attribute+3 is WELL worth it to me, when Moonlight gives you the same STP and Acc/Atk+8 along with significantly better defensive perks (not just the DT-5%, but also HP+110 and no Enm+5 that you probably don't want). And no need to use any other slots aside from Sakpata, Cape, and 1 ring for DT-50%.

Also, your TP1 set mistakenly shows two D.Rings. Or if that's not a mistake, please teach me how to wear two of 'em :)

EDIT:
Also, if using DA+10 augment on cape, your 5/5 Sakpata TP set is already over 100% DA without rings, making the DA on Petrov useless and actually a worse choice than Moonlight (or other options like Chirich +1), even if focused solely on DPS. So be aware you'd need to be using STP cape augment or something to even have that ring choice make any sense.

WAR traits/gifts (master)/merits: DA+33%
Sakpata 5/5: DA+30%
Cape: DA+10%
Ammo: DA+3%
Neck R25: DA+7%
Brutal/Schere: DA+11%
Ioskeha +1: DA+9%
------
Total: DA+103%

Why would you use Coiste in this situation over Aurgelmir +1?
 Asura.Cambion
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By Asura.Cambion 2021-06-23 19:02:16
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Phoenix.Capuchin said: »
Well aware I'm very late to reply to this, but...

1: Full Sakpata is 40 DT, not 38. 7+10+8+9+6

2: I tend to prefer just sticking DT-5% on back and using Moonlight/Niq for rings. Capped DT with minimal impact on offense. The slight DPS difference from losing Petrov's DA+1% & attribute+3 is WELL worth it to me, when Moonlight gives you the same STP and Acc/Atk+8 along with significantly better defensive perks (not just the DT-5%, but also HP+110 and no Enm+5 that you probably don't want). And no need to use any other slots aside from Sakpata, Cape, and 1 ring for DT-50%.

3: Also, your TP1 set mistakenly shows two D.Rings. Or if that's not a mistake, please teach me how to wear two of 'em :)

EDIT:
4: Also, if using DA+10 augment on cape, your 5/5 Sakpata TP set is already over 100% DA without rings, making the DA on Petrov useless and actually a worse choice than Moonlight (or other options like Chirich +1), even if focused solely on DPS. So be aware you'd need to be using STP cape augment or something to even have that ring choice make any sense.

WAR traits/gifts (master)/merits: DA+33%
Sakpata 5/5: DA+30%
Cape: DA+10%
Ammo: DA+3%
Neck R25: DA+7%
Brutal/Schere: DA+11%
Ioskeha +1: DA+9%
------
Total: DA+103%

1: You are correct, my apologies.
2: Fine, use a Moonlight, it's better survivability, but that's not the conversation being had, so moot point in this discussion.
3: If you read the post, I clearly stated it's Vocane+D Ring, there's no need for me to add an entire new gear item to the spreadsheet as the only purpose is to delete any DPS stats for accurate comparison.
4: Petrov is not there for the DA, it's there for the stp. Moonlight has the same sTP value, Chirich+1 is 1sTP more, but sacrifices 3str and 3dex. If you can justify the gil and inventory, then go for it. 20M for Moonlight, 8M for Chirich, or 0gil for Petrov.

I believe people are using 'full Sakpata' as a lazy crutch, so I was offering, or at least trying to get a discussion going, on how to most efficiently optimize our Hybrid sets.

Cerberus.Shadowmeld said: »
Why would you use Coiste in this situation over Aurgelmir +1?
I shouldn't have had Coiste in there in the first place, so thanks for drawing attention to this.

If you are using full Sakpata, you shouldn't use Coiste or Aurgulmir+1, because full Sakpata isn't capped-gear-haste, and Hasty Pinion +1 beats them both by a decent margin 2~300dps. (There may be alternates, which again... was the entire point of my post, to discuss the min/max of our Hybrid Sets.)

After updating the items the Full Sakpata set comes to 14,901. The set I listed originally still sits at 15,727. 826DPS in this specific scenario.

If I drop this from 1hr spams to just a typical party setup, then the DPS is only 8850 full Sakpata (Hetaoroi) to 9014 of the proposed set, so only 164DPS gain, but at 50% of the total DPS. So, roughly 5.5% gain with 1hrs, and 1.8% gain in a typical scenario.

I've been using the set for a month now and haven't run into any issues yet. Cycling to full Sovereign+1 or full Nyame is always just a click away for those real bad scenarios.

Asura.Failaras said: »
So I haven't started gearing Warrior yet but am very interested in it and had two questions:

1) Would the gear sets on page 1 be a good starting point for Non-Sakpata owners? It looks like it is a little out dated but I'm not sure how far off it is as a jumping off point for a newer Warrior.

2) The only job I have geared right now is Samurai and I've seen Sailfi+1 augmented pushed over Ioskeha +1 for that job, why is Ioskeha +1 better for Warrior? Is it because of the DA damage on JSE cape or something else?

WELL LOOK WHO IT IS! Sup Fail!
I didn't look at page 1, but the answer is two fold.
1: Sakpata is obtainable within 3 days of returning, don't let Odyssey intimidate you. Sneak through floors A and B and C in 15 minutes just to get the clears. (Technically you could Farm Shaeol C with a group, but if gear is a concern this is the easy way) then, join a Lvl 0 run of the Sakpata NM just for the clear. Buy the gear, and you're good to go.
2: Ambuscade gear Flamma and Sulv...something. And Tatenashi gear (from Unity NMs) which are easy to farm with most jobs. Relic and AF gear for augmenting Berserk/Warcy, and the Legs/Feet depending on your access. Full gearing War to a top tier DD, can be done in 1-2 weeks IMO, and I just did it.
Hit me up if you're in game and remember me.
 Asura.Geriond
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By Asura.Geriond 2021-06-23 19:56:34
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You could use Sailfi +1 and Coiste over Ioskeha +1 and Hasty Pinion +1, which leaves you at 99% DA and down 27 ACC, but adds 2% TA, 20 STR, 20 attack, and 6 STP.
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 Asura.Cambion
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By Asura.Cambion 2021-06-23 21:24:51
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Asura.Geriond said: »
You could use Sailfi +1 and Coiste over Ioskeha +1 and Hasty Pinion +1, which leaves you at 99% DA and down 27 ACC, but adds 2% TA, 20 STR, 20 attack, and 6 STP.
Because of rounding in the game (xx/256), you need 26% haste, the gain of 1% from the proposed changes, still leaves you 1 short, and is therefore still a DPS loss. (Granted it's small)
 Serjero
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By Serjero 2021-06-23 22:55:37
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Asura.Cambion said: »
Because of rounding in the game (xx/256), you need 26% haste, the gain of 1% from the proposed changes, still leaves you 1 short, and is therefore still a DPS loss. (Granted it's small)

Green Wyvern Cheer
 Phoenix.Capuchin
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By Phoenix.Capuchin 2021-06-24 00:43:55
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Asura.Cambion said: »
4: Petrov is not there for the DA, it's there for the stp. Moonlight has the same sTP value, Chirich+1 is 1sTP more, but sacrifices 3str and 3dex. If you can justify the gil and inventory, then go for it. 20M for Moonlight, 8M for Chirich, or 0gil for Petrov.

I didn't realize this was a question of "what's the best bang for your buck", I thought it was "what's best". But yeah, there are options on the cheap too.

Anyway, Moonlight is highly useful for many jobs, so not that strange of a suggestion IMO and it's perfectly suited to hybrid sets for the jobs that can use it. Petrov/Moonlight/Chirich are all practically sidegrades from an offensive POV, so out of that group why wouldn't you choose the only one that also comes with excellent defensive benefits (and doesn't have undesirable stats like Petrov's Enmity+5)? Even comparing just that one ring slot in a vacuum, that's an easy call - and Moonlight likely also frees up another slot where you no longer need to consider DT- and can instead use better offensive gear, resulting in a clear offensive advantage for the overall set.

Cerberus.Shadowmeld said: »
If you are using full Sakpata, you shouldn't use Coiste or Aurgulmir+1, because full Sakpata isn't capped-gear-haste, and Hasty Pinion +1 beats them both by a decent margin 2~300dps. (There may be alternates, which again... was the entire point of my post, to discuss the min/max of our Hybrid Sets.)

If you need some extra haste, augmented Seething Bomblet +1 is way better than Hasty Pinion +1.

Seething +1: Acc+13 Atk+13 MAB+7 STR+1~5 base stats, plus STR+10 Haste +5% from R15 augment
Hasty +1: Acc+10 Atk+10 Haste+2% STP-3 (gross)

Augmenting Unity ammo does cost some gil too, but it's a great piece for several jobs (I make good use of it on my DRK NIN too) and also does double duty for some relevant WS - Resolution, Decimation, Stardiver, etc. While I'm not sure of the stats by augment level, since Seething already has better STR/Acc/Atk/STP from base stats, you probably only need a few of the cheap early ranks to get to Haste +1~2% and overtake Hasty+1. Not a very big investment.
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 Cerberus.Shadowmeld
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By Cerberus.Shadowmeld 2021-06-24 01:02:41
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Shouldn’t use hasty pinion either. Seething bomblet +1 with augment gives more haste acc atack and no stp penalty
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 Asura.Cambion
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By Asura.Cambion 2021-06-24 02:46:40
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Phoenix.Capuchin said: »
I didn't realize this was a question of "what's the best bang for your buck", I thought it was "what's best".
...
Petrov/Moonlight/Chirich are all practically sidegrades from an offensive POV.

Lol? I said, and now you've admitted, from an offensive POV they are the exact same. So "what's best" is the free one.

I'm trying to discuss ways to optimize DPS and you keep repeating 'more hp and less enmity!1!' as if it's a valid answer. We don't seem to be having the same conversation. I'm proposing that full Sakpata is too defensive and we can make some sacrifices to gain more DPS. So far your response has been "what if we add more defensiveness?"

Phoenix.Capuchin said: »
If you need some extra haste, augmented Seething Bomblet +1 is way better than Hasty Pinion +1.
Good call on Seething+1 Aug, but you're still completely missing the point of what I'm trying to propose to you.

The set I've offered was over 800 DPS ahead.
Changing Petrov to Moonlight for 110hp isn't closing that gap.
Coiste vs Aurglir vs Seething, also aren't closing that gap. They're still useful conversations for people who intend to use full Sakpata. But even in non-1hr scenarios, we're still talking in upwards of 300DPS, based on buffs. To me, that matters.

But I'm asking, has anyone found a better way to maximize DPS, without sacrificing the ability to stay alive? Are you currently dying in your full Sakpata set often enough to consider it an issue, or where you felt your gear was directly responsible? Do you find that if you don't use Sakpata you die too easily?

Less important, but worth noting; the set you're proposing isn't just 20M for Moonlight, it's another 12M for Seething Aug, another 60M for War Beads+2, 9M for 3 additional pieces of Sakpata... we're talking ~100M investment to do less damage than an Ambu head and free DT accessories.

Maybe you already have all those things, so to you it doesn't matter, but it's still relevant information that people might want to take into account.
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By SimonSes 2021-06-24 03:40:12
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Serjero said: »
Asura.Cambion said: »
Because of rounding in the game (xx/256), you need 26% haste, the gain of 1% from the proposed changes, still leaves you 1 short, and is therefore still a DPS loss. (Granted it's small)

Green Wyvern Cheer

Thats magic haste not gear haste.
 SimonSes
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By SimonSes 2021-06-24 03:55:54
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Asura.Cambion said: »
Less important, but worth noting; the set you're proposing isn't just 20M for Moonlight, it's another 12M for Seething Aug, another 60M for War Beads+2, 9M for 3 additional pieces of Sakpata... we're talking ~100M investment to do less damage than an Ambu head and free DT accessories.

Full Sakpata's have MEVA beside DT. Set that you proposed is only DT with not enough MEVA, so in practical scenario it wont work better when you are against many debuffs or even big magic damage with some -mdb aura.
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