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Gay Marriage Now Legal Across the US
Bahamut.Milamber
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By Bahamut.Milamber 2015-06-26 12:19:33
Quote: This is a naked judicial claim to legislative—indeed, super-legislative—power; a claim fundamentally at odds with our system of government. Except as limited by a constitutional prohibition agreed to by the People, the States are free to adopt whatever laws they like, even those that offend the esteemed Justices’ “reasoned judgment.” A system of government that makes the People subordinate to a committee of nine unelected lawyers does not deserve to be called a democracy.
Favorite part of Scalia's dissent Did you know that interracial marriages have only been legal since 1967?
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Valefor.Sehachan
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By Valefor.Sehachan 2015-06-26 12:19:46
But not in a gay kind of way.
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By Odin.Jassik 2015-06-26 12:20:04
The church takes the bible pretty serious, especially leviticus.
Not even close. Churches take the parts they like and throw out the rest. I've attended church out of interest throughout my life and I've yet to hear a priest/minister/preacher teach Leviticus outside of condemning gays. contraception, and homosexuality. What's more, most churches I've attended teach things directly in opposition to the teachings of Christ.
I cannot figure out where this perceived persecution of religion is coming from, because in every single case concerning religious establishments, they've come out on top regardless of the situation.
I'd also like to point out that if any secular organization was responsible for allowing and covering up rampant sexual assault of children, the DoJ would have come in with a blowtorch.
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By Ramyrez 2015-06-26 12:20:46
Never mind.
Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2015-06-26 12:21:11
Come on now you know what part i am talking about.
Precisely. They don't believe in the Old Testament as a whole, or even any specific book as a whole.
They pick and choose so they can have a target for their scorn.
Okay, so apparently you don't understand why Christian churches don't comply with the Old Testament still.
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By Shiva.Viciousss 2015-06-26 12:21:18
I cannot figure out where this perceived persecution of religion is coming from, because in every single case concerning religious establishments, they've come out on top regardless of the situation.
Its called fear mongering, its all they have now.
By Ramyrez 2015-06-26 12:22:00
Okay, so apparently you don't understand why Christian churches don't comply with the Old Testament still.
Apparently you don't understand you can't just take parts of it that appeal to you.
Otherwise it loses all its power as a sacred text.
Not that it had any in the first place, but you can't even pretend if you don't follow the whole thing.
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Ragnarok.Nausi
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By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-06-26 12:22:55
Quote: This is a naked judicial claim to legislative—indeed, super-legislative—power; a claim fundamentally at odds with our system of government. Except as limited by a constitutional prohibition agreed to by the People, the States are free to adopt whatever laws they like, even those that offend the esteemed Justices’ “reasoned judgment.” A system of government that makes the People subordinate to a committee of nine unelected lawyers does not deserve to be called a democracy.
Favorite part of Scalia's dissent Did you know that interracial marriages have only been legal since 1967?
So when can we change the law so that we can marry immediate family, children, and multiple partners? I mean don't tell me we get to use some kind of "judgement" to discriminate against one thing or another cause clearly that's not the case today.
By Ramyrez 2015-06-26 12:23:33
I cannot figure out where this perceived persecution of religion is coming from
From Jimmy.
Rustled Jimmy.
Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2015-06-26 12:24:14
Okay, so apparently you don't understand why Christian churches don't comply with the Old Testament still.
Apparently you don't understand you can't just take parts of it that appeal to you.
Otherwise it loses all its power as a sacred text.
Not that it had any in the first place, but you can't even pretend if you don't follow the whole thing.
Don't get me wrong, the cherry picking of parts is a big problem. It's just that a ton of the Old Testament laws don't need to be followed anymore according to Christianity, and it has nothing to do with cherry picking.
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By Bahamut.Seekerstar 2015-06-26 12:24:28
If churches take Leviticus seriously, then there's gonna be trouble come Judgement Day.
Or do those churches perform sacrifices for the various offerings on the Sabbath?
Yes, yes, the New Testament changed all that, but he specifically mentioned the laws laid down in the Old.
Rules change, and for all we know one of the Bible's translators way back was a homophobe and threw all that in.
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Administrator
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By Drama Torama 2015-06-26 12:25:00
They're not supposed to follow the OT at all. The whole point of the NT is that it invalidates the OT to some extent.
Jesus: "Ok, you jackwagons can't be trusted with so many rules, you just cherry pick them and can't follow half of them anyway. And shrimp is ok, properly prepared. So tell you what, forget all that, two rules, two rules only:
- Love God
- Love your neighbor as yourself
Do those two, and everything else basically follows, right? You wouldn't murder or steal from someone you love as much as you love yourself, so this should be a no brainer. Just, don't be a ***, yo."
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By Ramyrez 2015-06-26 12:25:06
Quote: This is a naked judicial claim to legislative—indeed, super-legislative—power; a claim fundamentally at odds with our system of government. Except as limited by a constitutional prohibition agreed to by the People, the States are free to adopt whatever laws they like, even those that offend the esteemed Justices’ “reasoned judgment.” A system of government that makes the People subordinate to a committee of nine unelected lawyers does not deserve to be called a democracy.
Favorite part of Scalia's dissent Did you know that interracial marriages have only been legal since 1967?
So when can we change the law so that we can marry immediate family, children, and multiple partners? I mean don't tell me we get to use some kind of "judgement" to discriminate against one thing or another cause clearly that's not the case today.
If you wanna put the spurs to your sister and have genetic garbage for children, go ahead. Just know I'll call you a hypocrite if you ask for public assistance to raise your severely disabled child.
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Bahamut.Milamber
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By Bahamut.Milamber 2015-06-26 12:25:16
Okay, so apparently you don't understand why Christian churches don't comply with the Old Testament still. So.... the 10 commandments are out?
By Ramyrez 2015-06-26 12:25:34
Just, don't be a ***, yo."
Too hard!
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Bahamut.Kara
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By Bahamut.Kara 2015-06-26 12:26:58
Come on now you know what part i am talking about.
Precisely. They don't believe in the Old Testament as a whole, or even any specific book as a whole.
They pick and choose so they can have a target for their scorn.
Okay, so apparently you don't understand why Christian churches don't comply with the Old Testament still. Wormfeeder is the one who brought leviticus into this conversation.
Battling against the religious institutions is pointless, why would you want to marry in a church that doesn't approve you anyway?
Smart people will understand this is about civil rights, not changing the shape of religions. The problem is that a good percentage of gays in this country are religious and they will want to get married in church. The church takes the bible pretty serious, especially leviticus.
By Ramyrez 2015-06-26 12:27:00
Don't get me wrong, the cherry picking of parts is a big problem. It's just that a ton of the Old Testament laws don't need to be followed anymore according to Christianity, and it has nothing to do with cherry picking.
...okay, well, we're discussing rules from Leviticus being taught as current, soooo...
You're not wrong. But you're failing to see why it is pertinent to the discussion at hand.
Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2015-06-26 12:27:47
Okay, so apparently you don't understand why Christian churches don't comply with the Old Testament still. So.... the 10 commandments are out?
All of them were reiterated in the New Testament to one extent or the other. And it doesn't invalidate everything from the Old Testament, mostly just the Mosaic Law.
Lakshmi.Flavin
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By Lakshmi.Flavin 2015-06-26 12:28:05
As far as I'm aware marriage in churches only has anything to do with the union being recognized by god or whatever that religion worships. I know Catholics, at least, have refused to marry heterosexual couples for a multitude of different reasons. I'm fairly certain you still have to register with the state and get a marriage license through the state for it to have any meaning legally.
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By Odin.Jassik 2015-06-26 12:28:41
Okay, so apparently you don't understand why Christian churches don't comply with the Old Testament still. So.... the 10 commandments are out?
All of them were reiterated in the New Testament to one extent or the other. And it doesn't invalidate everything from the Old Testament, mostly just the Mosaic Law.
I don't remember Jesus saying anything about homosexuality.
Bahamut.Milamber
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By Bahamut.Milamber 2015-06-26 12:29:36
Okay, so apparently you don't understand why Christian churches don't comply with the Old Testament still. So.... the 10 commandments are out?
All of them were reiterated in the New Testament to one extent or the other. And it doesn't invalidate everything from the Old Testament, mostly just the Mosaic Law.
So, is there a list of things that are permitted / forbidden? Because this is starting to feel like the IRS tax code.
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Valefor.Sehachan
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By Valefor.Sehachan 2015-06-26 12:30:02
I don't remember Jesus saying anything about homosexuality. Were you there that day?!
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By Ramyrez 2015-06-26 12:30:28
I'm fairly certain you still have to register with the state and get a marriage license through the state for it to have any meaning legally.
You do.
I know Catholics, at least, have refused to marry heterosexual couples for a multitude of different reasons.
They do it frequently. They also will refuse to baptise babies born out of wedlock/to a second marriage for which they did not provide an anullment.
This all depends upon the specific priest, more or less, and how stringent his beliefs and interpretations are.
Father Kuba told my mother-in-law to get the *** out when she tried to get the twins baptised. But I know that subsequent to him, Father Phil was a pretty open-minded fella.
He even discussed the Life of Brian with me.
By Ramyrez 2015-06-26 12:31:23
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By Bahamut.Seekerstar 2015-06-26 12:31:33
Jesus loved everyone, so I'm fairly sure he'd have been OK with it.
I mean, he didn't even condemn those who crucified him and betrayed him. Two strangers of the same gender wishing to formalize their union really shouldn't be a blip on the radar.
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Administrator
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By Drama Torama 2015-06-26 12:33:01
So, is there a list of things that are permitted / forbidden? Because this is starting to feel like the IRS tax code.
The point of the NT was to simplifiy it. Two rules, now: Love God, love your neighbor as yourself. That's it. Everything else is a natural extension of those two.
The New Testament on the whole can be boiled down to: Jesus was a cool guy, gave us simpler rules, and had to die so that his dad wouldn't send us all to Hell.
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Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2015-06-26 12:33:21
Okay, so apparently you don't understand why Christian churches don't comply with the Old Testament still. So.... the 10 commandments are out?
All of them were reiterated in the New Testament to one extent or the other. And it doesn't invalidate everything from the Old Testament, mostly just the Mosaic Law.
I don't remember Jesus saying anything about homosexuality.
The people who rely on the Bible alone to make that judgment certainly have to stretch, so I'll give you that.
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By Odin.Jassik 2015-06-26 12:33:55
I don't remember Jesus saying anything about homosexuality. Were you there that day?!
Must have been a day I was out gambling and having pre-marital sex.
The people who rely on the Bible alone to make that judgment certainly have to stretch, so I'll give you that.
Respectfully, what else could a Christian use to make that judgement?
Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2015-06-26 12:34:30
So, is there a list of things that are permitted / forbidden? Because this is starting to feel like the IRS tax code.
The point of the NT was to simplifiy it. Two rules, now: Love God, love your neighbor as yourself. That's it. Everything else is a natural extension of those two.
The New Testament on the whole can be boiled down to: Jesus was a cool guy, gave us simpler rules, and had to die so that his dad wouldn't send us all to Hell.
No, it was never stipulated that those are the only two rules. Those are the greatest rules according to Jesus.
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By Ramyrez 2015-06-26 12:35:20
No, it was never stipulated that those are the only two rules. Those are the greatest rules according to Jesus.
Everything else is a natural extension of those two.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/gay-marriage-and-other-major-rulings-at-the-supreme-court/2015/06/25/ef75a120-1b6d-11e5-bd7f-4611a60dd8e5_story.html?tid=sm_tw
Quote: The Supreme Court on Friday delivered a historic victory for gay rights, ruling 5 to 4 that the Constitution requires that same-sex couples be allowed to marry no matter where they live and that states may no longer reserve the right only for heterosexual couples.
The court’s action marks the culmination of an unprecedented upheaval in public opinion and the nation’s jurisprudence. Advocates called it the most pressing civil rights issue of modern times, while critics said the courts had sent the country into uncharted territory by changing the traditional definition of marriage.
This is a monumental day for LGBT rights.
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