Random Politics & Arguments Over Nothing #16

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フォーラム » Everything Else » Politics and Religion » Random Politics & Arguments Over Nothing #16
Random Politics & Arguments Over Nothing #16
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 Ragnarok.Nausi
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By Ragnarok.Nausi 2016-12-15 12:05:34  
eliroo said: »
Viciouss said: »
The Russian hacking


This isn't a good term for it. Everyone thinks they are hacking the polling machines when really it is just refering to them hacking the emails.
That's the point, to confound the issue so that anyone who says trumps election is legitimate actually means he Russians never hack us.
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 Phoenix.Xantavia
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By Phoenix.Xantavia 2016-12-15 14:37:18  
Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Ramyrez said: »
If he's the one doing the corrupting by paying people off, that's even worse, and he almost undoubtedly has done this.
If we are going to go that route, then you have done the exact same thing.

I say that because I have as much evidence as you do.
Will you believe it when it comes directly from the god-emperor himself?
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 Asura.Saevel
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By Asura.Saevel 2016-12-15 16:14:18  
That debate was pretty awesome when he announced that he had paid Hillary off. It is what cemented his popularity with rural voters and liberals just can't understand why.

So here's how that works. We all already know that politicians are corrupt and work with powerful entities to get elected. Pointing at a candidate and screaming "they are CORRUPT!" doesn't really matter, it's like pointing at the rain and saying "It's really WET!". Now all those candidates will stand there and say they don't participate in corrupt practices, which we know is a straight lie, and then the business people swear they don't do it either, again we know it's a lie. Then someone comes along and says "hell yeah I've done that, it's broke and it's wrong, we shouldn't have do it". The fact that he's honest about it scores massive points with people who are used to being politically incorrect and honest with each other. People who deeply distrust others who lie to your face with "political correctness".
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 Asura.Kingnobody
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2016-12-15 16:22:33  
Terlet Sangria said: »
Zero chance of this happening. Even if I re-enabled it globally someday in a fit of idiocy, yours stays off forever, just because you whine about it so much.
/puts Rooks on The List

Terlet Sangria said: »
If you really want to put someone's ego ahead of Donald Trump's on the ladder, then maybe you need to admit that you're just rooting for laundry at this point
You cannot quantify ego with namebrand.

I mean, that is his money right there. It's not egotistical to sell one's name.

Ramyrez said: »
Yet neither Clinton is in prison for anything, and it doesn't stop you from maligning them.
SHE
WAS
NEVER
CHARGED
AND
PROSECUTED

That's like having witnesses watching a murder take place, but then you saying the murderer is innocent because a trial never occurred and the murder was never prosecuted.

Ramyrez said: »
And there's evidence Trump has abused his own charity...
And he was slapped with a fine. There's evidence of Clinton abusing her charity, but let's ignore that because TRUMP JUST PICKED HIS NOSE, LET'S TRY HIM FOR TREASON!!!!!

Ramyrez said: »
I am far, far too poor to pay anyone off for anything.
ftfy. I mean, I'm sure you had some sort of traffic ticket once in your life. Did you fight it in court, or did you pay off the county and went on with your life?
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 Asura.Kingnobody
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2016-12-15 16:25:55  
Phoenix.Xantavia said: »
Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Ramyrez said: »
If he's the one doing the corrupting by paying people off, that's even worse, and he almost undoubtedly has done this.
If we are going to go that route, then you have done the exact same thing.

I say that because I have as much evidence as you do.
Will you believe it when it comes directly from the god-emperor himself?
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It was a tactical ploy of Trump to put a stronger spotlight on Clinton's corruption.

Doesn't matter if it's true or not, the intended effect is to make Clinton look even more corrupt.

And if it is true? All that shows is that Trump knows how the system works and plays them all like fiddles that they are.

In other words:

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 Cerberus.Pleebo
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By Cerberus.Pleebo 2016-12-15 17:12:56  
Asura.Kingnobody said: »
That's like having witnesses watching a murder take place, but then you saying the murderer is innocent because a trial never occurred and the murder was never prosecuted.
Mmmm, that's kinda how the justice system works here.
 Lakshmi.Flavin
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By Lakshmi.Flavin 2016-12-15 17:16:43  
For someone who's refused to vote for trump you sure are a staunch defender now and quite the supporter of his magnificence...
 Asura.Kingnobody
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2016-12-15 18:46:47  
Lakshmi.Flavin said: »
For someone who's refused to vote for trump you sure are a staunch defender now and quite the supporter of his magnificence...
Good troll attempt.

I give it a 6/10, the execution could be a little better.

You also lost points for not calling me a racist.
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By fonewear 2016-12-15 19:07:57  
The best Beatles song ever:

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By fonewear 2016-12-15 19:35:39  
You guys need to get this game:

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 Garuda.Chanti
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By Garuda.Chanti 2016-12-15 20:50:03  
Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Ramyrez said: »
Yet neither Clinton is in prison for anything, and it doesn't stop you from maligning them.
SHE
WAS
NEVER
CHARGED
AND
PROSECUTED
It was St. Ronald the President who set the high standard of "never indited."
 Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2016-12-15 20:55:29  
Cerberus.Pleebo said: »
Asura.Kingnobody said: »
That's like having witnesses watching a murder take place, but then you saying the murderer is innocent because a trial never occurred and the murder was never prosecuted.
Mmmm, that's kinda how the justice system works here.

The justice system doesn't determine reality, it just determines punishment. A murderer's a murderer whether a judge says so or not, and as long as people act within the law they have a right to think whatever they want.

Also, if Hillary were subject to the same justice system as us lowly peons then we wouldn't be having this discussion.
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By Yatenkou 2016-12-15 21:31:02  
Lakshmi.Flavin said: »
Yatenkou said: »
I'm still waiting to hear from you on why you think that woman is a more credible source than anyone on allepo...
Sorry for the long reply, because she went to Aleppo 4 times, 6 times in Syria in total on her own independent journalism. Interviews among other things detailing the thoughts, along with going up to the UN herself denouncing the corporate media. Basically she went herself, and she has proof that this isn't the case.
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By Yatenkou 2016-12-15 21:31:18  
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By Skjalfeirdotter 2016-12-16 04:34:55  
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By Ramyrez 2016-12-16 07:54:19  
Asura.Saevel said: »
with people who are used to being politically incorrect and honest with each other.

The only problem with this is that "politically correct" is, like "racism" and various degrees of Godwin'ing, overused.

Some PC ***goes way to far and really is PC nonsense. Some of it is being a decent person vs. actually being a cultural troglodyte.

This is a bit tangential, but I think it's a discussion worth pursuing.

Getting upset someone says "negro" instead of "African American" or that someone says "Indian" and not "Native American" is being PC and picky. While a bit antiquated (especially the former), most people using such terms are not saying so with malice.

Not calling black Americans "jungle bunnies," to use a mild example, isn't "being PC," it's "not being a backward piece of ***."

One is antiquated, one has always been riddled with malice and contempt.
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 Ragnarok.Nausi
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By Ragnarok.Nausi 2016-12-16 07:56:19  
I'm pretty sure Clinton is still going to be prosecuted
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By Ramyrez 2016-12-16 08:04:17  
Bahamut.Ravael said: »
Also, if Hillary were subject to the same justice system as us lowly peons then we wouldn't be having this discussion.

If Donald were subject to the same justice system he'd...

...oh wait. Rich people have always gotten away with sexual assault. Never mind.
 Lakshmi.Zerowone
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By Lakshmi.Zerowone 2016-12-16 08:13:04  
Ramyrez said: »
Bahamut.Ravael said: »
Also, if Hillary were subject to the same justice system as us lowly peons then we wouldn't be having this discussion.

If Donald were subject to the same justice system he'd...

...oh wait. Rich people have always gotten away with sexual assault. Never mind.

Quote:
"I can't understand the air of impeccable condescension, from some here, that a vote for Trump was such proof of their own superior wisdom that it eclipses all doubt about his qualifications, his temperament, his honesty in business and his veracity in speech. We're excluding lessons of history and the demands of common sense"
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 Lakshmi.Flavin
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By Lakshmi.Flavin 2016-12-16 08:14:51  
Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Lakshmi.Flavin said: »
For someone who's refused to vote for trump you sure are a staunch defender now and quite the supporter of his magnificence...
Good troll attempt.

I give it a 6/10, the execution could be a little better.

You also lost points for not calling me a racist.
How is it trolling? You didn't vote for him... you clearly said he was a shitty candidate... now you defend him at every turn and call some of his moves quite calculated and great lol...

Is this one of those things where you just call troll to call troll and then move on because you have nothing better to say?
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By Ramyrez 2016-12-16 08:16:57  
Lakshmi.Flavin said: »
Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Lakshmi.Flavin said: »
For someone who's refused to vote for trump you sure are a staunch defender now and quite the supporter of his magnificence...
Good troll attempt.

I give it a 6/10, the execution could be a little better.

You also lost points for not calling me a racist.
How is it trolling? You didn't vote for him... you clearly said he was a shitty candidate... now you defend him at every turn and call some of his moves quite calculated and great lol...

Is this one of those things where you just call troll to call troll and then move on because you have nothing better to say?

I think you're misunderstanding his motivations, or maybe just ignoring them to actually troll him a little.

This isn't about supporting anyone directly, it's about supporting someone to attack ideas and concepts that he believes negatively effect him personally.
 Lakshmi.Flavin
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By Lakshmi.Flavin 2016-12-16 08:17:00  
Yatenkou said: »
Lakshmi.Flavin said: »
Yatenkou said: »
I'm still waiting to hear from you on why you think that woman is a more credible source than anyone on allepo...
Sorry for the long reply, because she went to Aleppo 4 times, 6 times in Syria in total on her own independent journalism. Interviews among other things detailing the thoughts, along with going up to the UN herself denouncing the corporate media. Basically she went herself, and she has proof that this isn't the case.
You should really go rewatch the whole thing and do some independent research on her and the whole situation in alleppo... I think your bias against the media is clouding your judgement...
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By Ramyrez 2016-12-16 08:17:53  
Ramyrez said: »
This isn't about supporting anyone directly, it's about supporting someone to attack ideas and concepts that he believes negatively effect him personally.

That is to say, he's doing exactly what all the "sensible, rational, right wing thinkers" here do; ignore that they're exactly the same as everyone on the left they decry.
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By Cruz Missive 2016-12-16 08:20:31  
Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
I'm pretty sure Clinton is still going to be prosecuted

No chance, for a couple of reasons.

- Team Clinton seems content to slink back and lick its wounds for the time being. Dragging this back to the forefront will just inspire them to cause more ruckus. And before you can say, "so what, we ain't scurred of them", they are still very rich and very influential - they can do quite a bit of damage if they think their backs are against the wall.

- Establishing a precedent of prosecuting opponents is not one The Donald should want to set for what I assume are obvious enough reasons.

He has precisely nothing to gain by that sort of thing going forward, and quite a bit to lose at this point, so even if there are elements that want to do so, I expect he'd put the kibosh on it.
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By Zerowone 2016-12-16 08:21:34  
Quote:
Reuters

China's military has carried out its first ever live-fire drills using an aircraft carrier and fighters in the northeastern Bohai Sea close to Korea, state media said.

China's growing military presence in the disputed South China Sea has fueled concern, with the United States criticizing its militarization of maritime outposts and holding regular air and naval patrols to ensure freedom of navigation.

No other country has claims in China's busy waterway of the Bohai Sea, but the drills come amid new tension over self-ruled Taiwan, following U.S. President-elect Donald Trump's recent telephone call with the island's president that upset Beijing.

Ten vessels and 10 aircraft engaged in air-to-air, air-to-sea and sea-to-air combat drills that featured guided missiles, state broadcaster Chinese Central Television reported late on Thursday.

"This is the first time an aircraft carrier squadron has performed drills with live ammunition and real troops," it said.

China's Soviet-built Liaoning aircraft carrier and a formation of warships carried out aerial interception, anti-aircraft and anti-missile drills, in which Shenyang J-15 fighter jets carrying live missiles also participated, CCTV said.

It broadcast images of fighter jets taking off from the carrier, firing missiles and destroying a target at sea.

The Liaoning has participated in previous military exercises, including some in the South China Sea, but the country is still years off from perfecting carrier operations similar to those the United States has practiced for decades.

On Wednesday, a U.S. think tank said China had been installing anti-aircraft and anti-missile systems on artificial islands in the South China Sea, prompting China to defend its right to install military hardware there.

China's exercises aim to test the equipment and troop training levels, an unidentified navy official told the official China News Service.

Last December the Defence Ministry confirmed China was building a second aircraft carrier to go with the existing vessel, but its launch date is unclear.

China keeps its aircraft carrier program a state secret, and CCTV blurred images showing the cockpit instrument panel of one aircraft involved in the Bohai Sea drills.

Beijing could build multiple aircraft carriers over the next 15 years, the Pentagon said in a report last year.

China's successful operation of the Liaoning is the first step in what state media and some military experts believe will be the deployment of domestically built carriers by 2020.

China...
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By fonewear 2016-12-16 08:26:53  
Ramyrez said: »
Ramyrez said: »
This isn't about supporting anyone directly, it's about supporting someone to attack ideas and concepts that he believes negatively effect him personally.

That is to say, he's doing exactly what all the "sensible, rational, right wing thinkers" here do; ignore that they're exactly the same as everyone on the left they decry.

Never quote yourself rule number 3,312 of the internet !
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By fonewear 2016-12-16 08:28:47  
Cruz Missive said: »
Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
I'm pretty sure Clinton is still going to be prosecuted

No chance, for a couple of reasons.

- Team Clinton seems content to slink back and lick its wounds for the time being. Dragging this back to the forefront will just inspire them to cause more ruckus. And before you can say, "so what, we ain't scurred of them", they are still very rich and very influential - they can do quite a bit of damage if they think their backs are against the wall.

- Establishing a precedent of prosecuting opponents is not one The Donald should want to set for what I assume are obvious enough reasons.

He has precisely nothing to gain by that sort of thing going forward, and quite a bit to lose at this point, so even if there are elements that want to do so, I expect he'd put the kibosh on it.

That and losers aren't worth thinking about. No one remembers who loses elections !
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By fonewear 2016-12-16 08:30:10  
I do look forward to day 121. We still don't have any proof that Russia hacked the election...but we are going to keep talking about it !
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 Lakshmi.Zerowone
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By Lakshmi.Zerowone 2016-12-16 08:36:54  
Quote:
WaPo (Paywall)

President Obama said the United States will retaliate against Russia over its malicious cyberactivity during this year's election, in an interview that will air Friday on NPR.

“I think there is no doubt that when any foreign government tries to impact the integrity of our elections . . . we need to take action,” the president said. “And we will — at a time and place of our own choosing. Some of it may be explicit and publicized; some of it may not be.”

The president did not comment on last week's Washington Post report, that was later confirmed by other outlets, that the CIA has concluded with high confidence that Russia intervened in the election specifically to help Donald Trump win the White House. Seventeen U.S. intelligence agencies publicly announced in October that they had concluded the theft of emails from the Democratic National Committee and Hillary Clinton's campaign manager John Podesta was undertaken by hackers working for Russia.

Speaking to “Morning Edition” host Steve Inskeep, Obama said “there are still a whole range of assessments taking place among the agencies,” and he is waiting for the report on cyberattacks he has ordered to be delivered by Jan. 20.

“And so when I receive a final report, you know, we'll be able to, I think, give us a comprehensive and best guess as to those motivations,” Obama said. “But that does not in any way, I think, detract from the basic point that everyone during the election perceived accurately — that in fact what the Russian hack had done was create more problems for the Clinton campaign than it had for the Trump campaign.”

“There's no doubt that it contributed to an atmosphere in which the only focus for weeks at a time, months at a time were Hillary's emails, the Clinton Foundation, political gossip surrounding the DNC,” he added.

"Why don't you just tell the world, aye?"
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