Random Politics & Religion #18

WHAT!!!! i cAn't hear you i'm BLASTING DUBSTEP in my LIBERAL ECHO CHAMBER

Pay no attention to nausi, when you are polling in the 30s after the first week, you have upset a lot more than just one side of the aisle.
Trump needs to drain his own swamp in the WH, way too many unqualified people are talking to him. He didn't even talk to the WH Counsel before this Muslim Ban, and the legal team looked completely unprepared in court last night.
When you are banning women and children from the country and allowing people from Egypt, Lebanon, Saudi Arabia and the UAE in, you know, the countries that the 9/11 hijackers came from, you can't hide behind the lie of trying to keep us safe.

yeah i mean his own VP tweeted this December '15




but who needs to pander anymore when you've got all 3 branches of government in the palm of your hand.

Is this how you guys are gonna act for the next 8 years? For Christ sake guys he has only been in office a week!

Depends. Is he going to stop doing stupid ***and appointing idiots as heads of everything? If not, then yes.

ha, yeah

Obama denied valid visa holders and US permanent residents the right to re-enter the US? Carter denied future visa holders the right to entry and ordered a review of student visas, those who were found to be in violation were then deported.

This is different.

People who have valid US legal visas and the same constitutional rights as US citizens were denied entry and were held in violation of due process and equal protection.

The reason so many Federal Courts ordered an immediate temporary injunction on parts of this EO directly related to these legal residents is because they have a good case and in all likelihood parts of this EO will be overruled or modified.

This is not even getting into people who were detained or denied entry who hold dual citizenship with one of our allied nations, potentially breaking treaties and international law.

alternative law

...that's all you care about, isn't it?

This even impacted people who had Visas approved prior and were in transit.

Given the cost of obtaining a VISA and the process there after; are these individuals refunded/able to financially recoup?

When I say cost I'm referring to total cost of the visa type and insurance service fees ex Blanket L-1 and SVEIS.

That's what some of us were saying 8 yrs ago.

If only the Legislative Branch would answer Donald's question

Stop reacting, actually read what was done and not from Huffpo or other "interpreted news" site. How you can agree or disagree about something without first knowing what it is? Oh right that's the liberal bias leaking through, that desire to conform to social norms which state he must be an evil overloard satan-incarnate and you must fight him regardless.

This isn't a ban, he temporary suspending accepting non-citizens from countries with high amounts of terrorist activity. These countries also happen to be extremely muslim and the terrorist activity is centered around that religion. This temporary ban is in place until they review the immigration policies of the previous President which were extremely unpopular towards voters. Political correctness was running rampant under Obama and many of his policies were executed to appease the PC Police rather then to further the national interests of the USA.

And here is the clincher, those super progressive socialist European countries that are always pointed to as perfect models of society? Yeah they have even stricter immigration policies then the USA does.

Anyhow there is a lot of hyperbole and unwarranted freaking out by the liberal demographics.

I doubt it.

When the US government takes in fees, whether entitled or not, they tend to not give them back without intensive legal fights.

funny example of this that has nothing to do with this debacle

The nice thing is that some airlines have stated they are giving full refunds to those affected, or trying to re-route "in-transit" visa holders not through the US so that they can get home, without additional cost.

But this is pretty insane. Google has over 150 US based workers affected. Many businesses are pretty flabbergasted and the US has hurt the credibility and risk of all visas they issue, no matter the country of origin.

I guess US businesses and many republicans are the "liberal demographics" now?

Aren't you a visa holder in South Korea? If SK started banning people and not guaranteeing the rights they have already agreed you have under their visa schemes, would you find this to be "hyperbole and unwarranted freaking out"?

Here is a break down of what it is, it's not a "Muslim Ban" because most of the worlds Muslims don't live in the seven countries specified.

https://www.theatlantic.com/news/archive/2017/01/trump-immigration-order-muslims/514844/

It's temporary (except the Syrian refugees) with a limited period of time until it's removed.

The recent judicial removal, does not strike it down or even modify it in a major way, despite liberal news agencies reporting on it. The decision was that those who are already approved for Permanent Residency (GC holders), Approved applications for Refugee status and those with already approved VISA's. This also doesn't mean they are immediately released, only that DHS can't immediately deport them and must follow due process. Believe it or not the USA actually has a special "Immigration Court" with actual judges that ensure the Constitutional protections are granted to anyone on American soil.

Really?

You mean the ACLU court petition and temporary injunction for visa holders asking the judge for due process and them not to be summarily deported is what he ruled on?

Amazing.

/s

All current ACLU court documents

FYI, Pence has recently stated they are going to now modify the EO so that green card holders are not affected. Let's see how it goes with the rest of the legal visa holders.

Edit:oops, meant Priebus, not Pence

Seems like overreacting to me, since the kinks will likely be ironed out in short order. But hey, I'll take overreacting over something real rather than what's been going on with Trump for the past year or so.

I think what's really grinding people's gears (or what really bothers me, at least) is the fact that he left Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Lebanon, Afghanistan, etc. off the list. Why do it at all if you're going to exclude the places that actually pose the most danger?

Feels more like a PR move just so his supporters can say "he's doing what he promised." And unfortunately, it is a sound tactic.

I heard Chuck Schumer is going to adopt a Syrian refugee...or hire them to clean his house at least !

Mike Pence on the Muslim ban

Because I can do whatever the *** I want in that regard. That's why.

Actually ....

Those countries are fine, well Lebanon and Afghanistan are kinda up in the air, but the others are a fairly stable government that isn't exporting terrorism to other countries. The countries that were named are countries who's governments are either exporting terrorists to other nations or who are in such a situation that terrorism is being exported de-facto. It's about which places are likely to have "refugees" or "students" that aren't either and instead are using our VISA system to sneak terrorists in.

Saudi doesn't export terrorism, they actually have extremely harsh penalties, their monarchy takes a very hard line stance against anarchists that like to blow things up. The terrorists that come from Saudi are ones that left and went to another country, usually one of those on that list, train there for awhile and then precede to the USA. The US already has a ban on those entering the USA who have recently traveled through one of those other nations but not on those who are from those other nations, so they were burning their passports and getting new ones instead. Egypt doesn't export terrorism and has a domestic system to hunt them down and kill them where found. People like to yell as Israel for it's practices against Islamic extremism but Egypt is even worse. Pakistan is also fairly benign when it comes to state support of terrorism. We could turn a hard eye on Turkey as they do support terrorism but in a way that wouldn't threaten the USA.

See this situation is FAR more complicated then "hurr durr he hatez deh muehslems peoplez gahh!!!" that the liberals are pushing.

In SK there is a huge foreigner worker population compromising Indonesians, Egyptians, Indians and even some Pakistanis. I happen to have many friends among those groups and let me tell you guys something, all the "moderate" Muslim countries are having problems with their own citizens traveling to Syria, Iran, Iraq and several of those countries who all happen to be on "that list". They get there and then immediately burn their former passports, join Isis and then arrange to have "new" passports issued with new names. They are "going to join their brothers in the fight" and it's scaring the moderate Islamic countries because their afraid these people will come back home and bring that extremist interpretation of Islam back with them. So they watch on who's doing this and if they come back they are summarily executed. I'm not making that up, those who do that are killed upon returning to their home countries because those nations don't want that extremist Islam spreading.

But hey the USA is supposed to open it's arms wide and accept the newly-trained bombers, err terrorists, err freedom fighters, umm "Liberal Approved Islamic Activists who are really Peaceful but Misunderstood".

Don't worry everyone will be outraged when Trump bans pizza next week !

I credit it more to the fact that imposing restrictions on those countries would have deeper repercussions because they are more powerful and have stronger governments. And also the fact that he has business interests in many of them.

But still an interesting response Saev.


Finally a protest we can all get behind!

It's where the terrorist training camps are. Those places can only exist in locations that the government is either too weak, too corrupt to stop them or actually supports and funds them. It's not about what country the citizen was originally from but what country they are receiving training and launching from. Those countries also happen to usually be war torn as the weak ineffectual government is trying to fight off the strong, organized ISIS insurgency. The refugees are caught in the middle and because the ISIS folks like to disguise their agents as international students or refugees. The smart response would be to error on the side of caution, but that's "Islamophobic" and "sensitive to cultural diversity", and thus President Obama pretty much hand waived them through to accept the "future Democrat voters".

But hey he's an evil capitalistic *** who's out to destroy the world and cause Armageddon by sacrificing poor Muslim children. Just look at his hair, that's all the proof we need of his duplicity.

I mean wow, progressives are alternating describing him as a complete buffoon who will slip on a banana, accidentally launching nuclear holocaust, and only got elected because Racist Evil White European Males had the audacity to vote this election. And that he's a corporate overlord criminal mastermind who's secretly working for the iluminati and working on a secret world agenda to perpetually enslave us all.

You can't have it both ways... unless the goal is to spread hate.

I've literally never seen any sane person claim Trump is a mastermind of anything.

But, y'know, okay.