Dev Tracker - Discussion

People were quitting after RoV ended. So they decided to add content such as Omen and Dynamis – Divergence. And the "such as" would also include Ambuscade. That conversation you posted only happened once, in your head.

I agree, in my case, theres far too many things i like about this game to quit over what i dont, i simply dont do what i dont like, or do it as lil as possible. Thats really all you can do as someone who still likes parts of a service but not other parts.

You seem to have issues with what I say, but like it or not, it's literally exactly what happened. Condensed for time though.

People have always, and will continue to be quitting, all the time, always. That's their own fault. Due to mismanagement. People will play this game for their entire god damn life, if you stop pissing them off.

They are now in "full panic mode" no one to blame but themselves.

That's my point. But I don't think SE is dissecting content metrics and determining how many people are doing how much of each, and then adjusting their plans accordingly. It's one big pot, one game. You can avoid Dynamis-D and Omen bosses and farm Aeonic's all day long; you're still utilizing the product at the end of the day. It doesn't matter which content you choose or if you boycott ambuscade or dynamis because playing = paying. So any negative commentary towards those who do a certain content is also directed right back. The point I was making is that you can have frustration with some aspects and continue playing, as long as you are enjoying the product overall. If the product was all-around garbage, the game would be over.

Every company. Every single one. Uses metrics.

They know every time you've ever done anything.

Logic; why did dienamis get a campaign adjustment so fast, but SR still has no campaigns? You already know the answer.

People have different goals and tastes. There's no way to make a game so perfect everyone will play their whole lives. There are those who stop playing just because they wanna try something new. Or because the graphics are old. Or they accomplished the parts they feel are important, like the missions.
As much as everyone claims they miss the lv 75 cap days, I know for a fact that I would not be playing anymore if the game was still like that because I have other responsibilities.
As a game gets old, people will quit and fewer new players will join. The management of the game will only slow down the process. And be as negative as you like, but considering that people still play this game after 16 years, it couldn't have been managed that poorly.

But I was pointing out that you distorted SE's comment. After RoV ended, there were not supposed to be any more updates. So people started quitting. That's when the dev team decided to keep adding content. You made it sound like, due to the people that quit in the last few months, they decided to add wave 3 to dyna d. That isn't what SE said.

There has not been a massive boycott among the players regarding Dynamis, though. If you asked SE, they would probably say that SR can be done an unlimited amount of times, whereas Dynamis cannot. Or they know that the drop rate was empirically horrible. Perhaps they were trying to flood people with mats to prepare them for a future update, or to get people their gear sooner rather than later, since the prices across servers were exorbitant for a few pieces. I still imagine they are going to lower the timer to once/20 hours very soon, because there's no functional reasoning behind 60hr lockout. Especially since the medals will be used in future weapon synths, can't see it staying at 60 hours.

They do things out of sheer randomness, to generate interest, to address a problem, or any other reason. When Capacity Points were introduced, they literally had a CP campaign that lasted several months. Was it because nobody was out CPing? Not really. Players complained about the rate of Capacity points, and then they adjusted certain RoE to give rewards and such. I still don't think it's a metrics thing.

You are correct that they know how many groups are doing the content. They said as much regarding some of the changes to Divergence. Early on, there just weren't enough players doing it, so they realized that they had to make it more desirable to bother doing. Wish they'd realize that a big chunk of why no one wanted to bother with it is that the gear sucks for quite a few jobs, and then actually fix them. <,<

There are more knobs to turn to affect Divergence than there are for SR. Divergence already used the personal loot system, so the framework was already there to add conditional campaign related drops for example. They can tweak drop rates directly for both personal/group loot. There probably aren't too many ways to add anything to SR without rebuilding the stupid NPC, and we all saw how long it took them to do that for Ambuscade... Though I'd personally like to see something similar to Vagary, with a random freebie tacked on to whatever reward you choose.. It seems doable to me, as long as they gave us the Decanter items rather than trying to make the system generate a 2nd random RNG'd drop directly.

There is absolutely and utterly nothing that indicates this to be true in any way, shape, or form. >_>;;

I'd not expect anything from Wave1/Wave2 to be involved in making the new weapons, as it makes no sense design-wise to do so. They are going to need to give non-crafters a reason to want to push to Wave3 beyond the pure challenge of doing so or nifty new titles.

Edit: I guess I should have stated gear rather than weapons. I misspoke. I should have been more general.

They leave the door open for the possibility that the new gear may use these medals (or something else they put into the zone). I chose to focus on what was already there.


It could be new items, but it also suggests it could be the medals, also.

People =/= Everyone


"Distorted" I guess I should have said;

or

I'm a little conflicted, mainly because I think that if they made both Omen and Dynamis-Divergence with a skeleton crew, I'd rate one of those two as a great success (even though I mostly find the other to be a disappointment)

Dyna[D]:
I'm kinda with Eiryl in that I think Dynamis[D] is a fairly bad event, and started out downright awful. However, they've been improving things with sellable void/shards/currency, and fairly quick campaigns to get the event closer to what it should have been.

There are still significant problems:
- the campaign drop system should almost be a standard feature
- the lockout timer is excessive
- the Vagary item bottleneck for +3s is unreasonable
- supply of shards and voids (non-body) on non-Asura servers is still a pretty significant bottleneck

Omen:
Omen, however, is quite impressive to me for something they pulled off with minimal resources. At least, once they corrected some initial flaws and allowed alliances & added the card farming floor (which were relatively quick additions). The objectives and boss gimmicks were fairly well done, it's conducive to group play for anything from a party to an alliance, a wide variety of jobs are viable, Ou KI requirements are reasonable but require a little bit of effort to cycle all wins for 5/5 beads. It might not be the most challenging content for the elite squads, but I'm happy where it ended up because I don't really like the top 5% being the baseline for balancing for the whole community.

It's still not perfect. I still think card acquisition rate is a little too low; should really be able to reliably card farm more like the Omen card campaign rate (not necessarily the PLUS campaign rate), and/or adjust the 10:1 trade-in value. Body drop rate is also laughable, and maybe needs some campaign to allow a better chance to get these (or a high difficulty version with better drop rate, and more challenge for the elite groups). But overall, Omen's positives greatly outweigh the negatives to me.

Future:
I'm kinda OK with attempts to continue to improve Dynamis, maybe they'll whip it into better shape even if it's not likely to ever be a personal favorite.

I actually like the idea of admitting their mistake with Aeonics (and failing to address the related SMN balance issues), and just power-creeping Aeonics a bit into obscurity by further buffing RME and making these new Dyna crafted weapons.

And, I at least have some cautious optimism that the people who made Omen are capable of pulling off some decent battle content when we get to the inevitable Empyrean Armor +2/+3. Even if they don't do Abyssea 2.0, there's enough they can work with to repurpose for new events (Limbus, VW, etc.)

I'm confident (don't quote me when they *** it up...) that they can't possibly *** up an Abyssea V2 for Empyrean.

Y'all may not like abyssea and what it was/did but I loved every single bit of abyssea. (except that the blue!! were largely useless with rare exception)

((and farming tahrongi.. they reallllllllly dropped the ball on that one)) So now that I mention that... ugh. Can't wait for the new Glavoid farm with 16 pre-nms for single drop "item" that you need 12 of to +2 Empyrean. Sorry.

The Vagary mat requirement is just fine tbh. These days we can make 5m per hr just casually spamming ambu VD, some people merc on top of that and sit on hundred million gil but nowhere to spend them. Game needs something for rich players to spend tons of gil on.

As a casual player with busy rl who can only do endgame event once a week, I find lock out timer totally ok. Although it may be a problem for those who wants to do endgame event every day.

The real problem of dyna is still lag fest in bigger group and boring, uninspired, NM with no reason to be killed. Hopefully at least wave 3 fix some of that.

In the SE replies, they never made any correlation between the July update to Dynamis and people quitting. What they said was that people began quitting after they were supposed to stop adding content, so they decided to resume adding content. You're the one who proceeded to distort that information and turn it into:

That's distortion of information.

None of that was about the July update.

Not their response. Nor my quote.

So what Dynamis upgrade are they begging us to play? What month is the "next month" you mentioned?

By Asura.Eiryl 2018-03-29 03:24:56
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March, about April's addition of new campaign. Because the previous "fixes" were't enough.

Well, if you hate Dynamis so much, don't play it. The rest of us will do what we want to do.

You're free to do so. You're just not allowed to *** about it.

It's your own fault if you choose to do it.

It's a very real fact that Divergence was poorly made/implemented/designed.

And if you failed to realize, almost everything I complained about in regards to divergence, they've adjusted. (I'm not saying they adjusted it directly because, I specifically, am the one that complained.)

What kind of one-sided biased fallacy is this? We aren't allowed to *** about anything because we still do the content and nothing will change by our bitching. But you're allowed to do *** about the content and not do it, and then they'll make adjustments because people like you bitched about it and didn't do it, so we should be thanking you for it. Kindly GTFOH with that.

What is it with this "You're not allowed to" do this or that mentality, anyways? You can complain about some aspect of something you don't agree with. We've all been complaining about Dynamis to some extent. Whether they fixed it off of the complainers-who-play-dynamis' merits the complainers-who-don't-play-dynamis' merits is irrelevent because it was addressed. Trying to point the credit towards your direction is silly. You don't have any high ground here. We all recognized the issue and said something about it and SE responded.

In fact, if you've complained about Dynamis and don't do it...why does it matter to you that they addressed what you complained about, if you don't do it anyways?

^^ he's not wrong, even a little bit...

Whether you complain or not isn't really my concern, but the fixes are surely an admission that they needed to address some pretty glaring flaws.

And I don't think they make changes because people (especially NA players) complain. They make changes because they see people aren't doing the content...

it's a simple concept.

You do "thing". You dislike "thing". You complain about "thing". but keep doing "thing".

"I" flat out REFUSE to do "thing" because "reason".

They get your money/metric REGARDLESS. They MIGHT get my money/metric if they change "thing". And "I" pay a LOT of subs.

I'm sure jp complaints helped

That would be an ideal concept, except for the fact that you and people like you just continued to play the entire time anyways, so they secured the bag in both instances. You can't play that high ground nonsense here because you're still playing(paying). Whether you are watering furrows or clearing red eyes, matters not.

There's no "high ground" here man.

I'm just simply informing you of things you seem not to know. It's hard to see when you're in the moment. Much easier to see when you step back and take an objective look at the bigger picture.

I NEED them to make things better. It's beneficial to ME for YOU (not specifically) to enjoy dynamis (and other events).

Fair enough. See people aren't doing content -> look at JP complaints to see why -> adjust content. But, if people are just doing the stuff anyway, there's no reason for the devs to even investigate why. And there's surely little consideration of anything the filthy EN players are griping about, we all know that ;P

I'm glad Dyna[D] started out with such a poor player response though, since that led to them actually improving it a bit more each revision. Perhaps the next changes will make it better still.

Players stopped doing Clamming in Bibiki Bay long ago and they have not taken note and addressed this in 14 years. WTFSE? I read on the forum posts that if you don't do content, they adjust it.

Screw Dynamis D. I'm going clamming!

Wait. if I do clamming, then they will know it's working as intended! Paradox!!!

Dynamis is a piece of ***,was a piece of ***, and will always be a piece of ***. Don't like the stupid lock out timer, don't like the minuscule drop rate, don't like the shitty stats on most of the gear, don't like the music, don't like the fact that they choose the shittiest zones.

SE can spray as much perfume as they want on dyna is still going to be ***underneath. Anymore questions?




Now excuse me as I go get ready for my dyna run.

Incoming- empyrean +3 gear will be made from drops that come from new iLvl HMNs in Dragon's Aery, Behemoth's Dominion, and the Valley of Sorrows. 21-24hr respawns. 25 of the items from these guys or 5 from the hq version that pops every 3-5 pop cycles.

Items are not guaranteed drops except for the campaign time which starts immediately for the first 4 days.