Corona Virus, How Has It Affected Your Area So Far?

Unless those first 100 were mostly settlements and bad charges that resolved faster than the other more complicated 900.

Kinda like the first deaths were the more at risk population so results set in faster vs those experiencing a longer process due to actually fighting it. Numbers help us, but we're not talking about the same factors with each situation, so until we've seen more full duration situations its impossible to compare what's happened already with what will happen

Why are you gung-ho about 60 hours/week? There are very few people who do that, and they make well over $10/hour (aka salaried people). Why don't you talk to us about your so-called perception of "slave wages" when all you do is move the goalposts?

They don't. At least not 100%.

Science is very straight forward. It's either yes, or no. 1, or 2.

There were entirely way too many decision changes on number of things from closing the border to using face masks. Just on 3/13 Trudeau was like "we are not banning international travel", 3 days later border closed. When they closed the border they were like "not closing border to the US", few days later that's closed too.

Their stance on face masks also changed. Went from "useless" to "Wear a non-medical face mask when shopping or using public transit".

If it's based on science why do they change stance this often? Science should be straight forward no? Things either work or they don't.

Let's be honest, their decisions are mostly based on politics/economy. That's where things are no longer straight forward.


Yup, discrediting WHO because they don't quite base everything on science. Most of us won't be able to see true inner workings and what their decisions are based on. Pretty sure it's not just "science".

So, are you saying that the world average wage is $10/hour?

That's not science, that's data (of which there are different types). What you conclude of the data = science, and, as you can see, that process isn't exaclty pure math, and this is one reason scientists disagree over various topics (the less data we have, the more disagreement you're gonna expect to see).

I feel as though most people here don't understand that minimum wage means you can afford a roof over your head, food for all your meals, electricity and clean water with no extra job or working overtime (37.5hrs a week). I'd throw internet and phone access into that because this past month has shown how essential those are. The money that some nations are giving out are calculated using minimum wage. If you think you ~$2000 a month (Canada) is too little for you live on but you insist raising the mimimum wage is some communist ploy then you have to do some soul searching my friend.


Or maybe, just maybe, the Canadian economy is tied so closely with the American economy that doing something such as closing the borders without some sort of agreement would cause both economies to crash.... Not to mention what kind of reliation the Trump administration would have tried. I mean they tried to stop 3M selling N95 masks to Canada just a couple weeks ago.

I wouldn't put it in those terms exactly, but I'd say you're right to some extent. Science is not absolute truth, it's just us doing the best we can with the data we've collected. It's a beautiful thing when done correctly, but it's also plagued by human error and scientists make mistakes in their fields just like everyone else.

I'm using worldwide data because it hasn't been in the US long enough for the US only data to be relevant.

That's like saying if one old guy on my street for infected and died, that it would have a 100% mortality rate. Or that because a women can birth a baby in one day, she could birth 365 in a year.

This


Is only important after a disease has passed through an area not before or during. When the pending cases are larger then the total sample size, the statistic itself is meaningless.

Or in other words, his statistic is 35% with an error bar of around ~50% meaning a mortality rate of between -15% and 85%. That's right, according to Draugo's math COVID-19 might actually be healing people.

Of course Trudeau isn't WHO, that's not his background.

But this person is:
https://www.who.int/about/who_reform/emergency-capacities/oversight-committee/theresa-tam/en/

I think it's utterly obvious that Dr.Tam has been closely following WHO when it comes to getting information.

I can get that it's possible that experts made a mistake/bad decision at one point, but things like closing the border, I'm 100% sure there's tons of politics involved.

Still wouldn't call it science. I really really doubt everything WHO said has 0 political reasons.
What I mean is that it's straight forward based on the data.

When scientists disagree with each other, they generally have a straight forward reasoning.

If Data is A, scientists will draw conclusion X base on data A, if data is B, scientists will conclusion Y base on data B.

Yes, there can be different conclusions based on different data, but generally there's always a base to draw conclusion on. That base is data.

This isn't the case in this entire COVID 19 incident. There's plenty of things that doesn't add up due to the inner workings behind it. That's politics.

When it comes to decisions like closing the border, and how/when to do it, it's mostly in the territory of politics. It's silly to call that "science".


This is correct, probably affects Canada more than the US. When it comes to decisions like this, politics will have higher priority than science.

They changed their wordings slightly. I can no longer find silly wordings like "false sense of security" on their website, which was there back in Jan.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/01/all-uk-hospital-staff-and-patients-should-wear-masks-says-doctors-group

Sometimes small change in wordings has significant meaning behind it. I was never expecting WHO come out and say "if you wear a mask you are 100% immune to the virus.". It would be silly to believe that. I was only expecting them to tone down some of the wording that may seem misleading, which has been causing people draw false conclusion like "face masks are useless" or even "face masks are harmful". THAT is unscientific.

It's obvious that their POV on the masks changed with more data available. And the entire reason why I disagree with WHO to begin with, it's their choice of words to begin with.

Edit:
And Dr.Tam certainly changed her stance about face masks. The wording that I used in previous post came from here.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-tam-offers-new-advice-wear-a-non-medical-mask-when-shopping-or-using/


I Don't know why you attacked him for his comment, he is probably not wrong at all.

The thing about the art of politics is that, people won't make clear statement about their true intentions. If WHO is indeed China's puppet, they aren't going write "Hey I am China's puppet" on their face. They are just going to generate reasonings that seem legit on surface, such as "science", to back up their decisions and convince people like you.

I'm all for going back to the 1950's era of taxing. Only loophole that existed for companies to save from paying exorbitant taxes was to invest that money in the company. Worker salaries, benefits, and upgrading work conditions all helped attribute to lower corporate taxes.

I'll also take with actually enforcing the laws and regulations we currently have regarding illegal immigrants. Lets get the people that overstayed their welcome and start shipping them back. That should deal with about 40% of illegal immigration if not more. Wall not needed.

Both sound reasonable. One thing is for certain though, the world simply cannot go back to the way things were before this started. This is one of those 'singularity moments' where everything comes to a head and societies are forced to look at themselves, and the image is not necessary flattering.

The important thing is, something can and should be done. The only way is forward and whether it's the left or the right in government, the road has to be started on.

I just hope it doesn't turn into another "post-9/11" moment where what changes permanently are the useless things like taking off shoes before boarding a plane and no more than 2 oz. of shampoo, but rather real changes that do need to be made.

I needed this laugh, you know full well that given the chance to exploit a disaster our government will do just that.

Just like the TSA was formed to make our lives miserable expedite and secure our travel I wouldn't be surprised if either a new government agency was formed or the CDC got a massive boost in funding and job duties.

Oh I am quite familiar with the words of Rahm Emmanuel.

Except the world doesn't work that way.

You are paid exactly the value of the type of work you put in. You negotiate the value of the type of work you put in. If you bid your value too high, employers will hire somebody else (aka you demand to be paid $100k a year for janitorial work). If you bid your value at the going rate, you will most likely get the job you want.

Want more money and value? Make yourself valuable instead of demanding to be paid more for less work. Why do you think lawyers and accountants are paid so much more than fast food and grocery store clerks? If you can't figure that out, there is no helping you.

Why are you using worldwide data when trying to debunk people saying that the current mortality rate in the US is 35%?

I'm sad for people like you.

That was the example I was given. But if you really, truly want comparisons, then the US's average wage is $131.43/hour vs. UK's average wage of $87.03/hour. And if you are honest with yourself, you have to use apples/apples comparison (40 hour work week for both, also both in USD, not EU or whatever funny currency you use).

I still don't see how working $10/hour is considered slave wage, or working 60 hours a week considered bad. Mind you, nobody, and I mean nobody works 60 hours a week making $10/hour. That is a ludicrous example meant to drive their socialist point (not you, Eiryl, although you have socialist ideas too.).
No, but $10 x 40 plus $15 x 20 is $700. Overtime kicks in at greater than 40 hours. That's US law.

If UK doesn't have that, well, too bad.