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What's good about FFXI.
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3113
By Asura.Aeonova 2021-11-27 14:36:53
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サーバ: Valefor
Game: FFXI
Posts: 19647
By Valefor.Prothescar 2021-11-27 14:41:37
Valefor.Prothescar said: »It's interesting to me that you claim to have done all of the hardest fights in XIV while subsequently being oblivious to the fact that the hardest mechanics in Savage and Ultimate fights don't have telegraphs.
Nobody jumps immediately into savage or ultimate. Once you've done the previous, the later are just "harder". They're by no means "strategic".
Except that's completely untrue, and what I'd label as a disingenuous minimization of the facts if I believed that you had ever done these things at all. There is no content in the game that prepares you for Ultimate fights, knowing the fights that the bosses were derived from does not give you any information on how to execute the mechanics in an ultimate outside of knowing what they're called.
For Savage, carry-over from Extremes/previous tiers of Savage raids only goes so far before you engage with either entirely new mechanics or new variants of the ones that you thought you had mastered. Optimization for each individual fight is almost entirely unique to that fight as well. It's like saying that I know how to fight Mboze just because I killed Yumcax, so I can just go in and get some R15 Bunzi ***rq.
It is real easy to sit there and claim that all you have to do is hit 1, 2, 3 and dodge the big glowing circles on the ground when you have no idea what you're actually talking about, though. I get it!
The dudes making six figures a year to raid in WoW coming over to XIV and not steamrolling it must just be complete brainlets with room temperature IQs who would never survive in XI, the thinking man's MMO.
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By Mattelot 2021-11-27 14:43:55
lmfao
Buddy, you need to stop believing the first thing you read on Google. That was such a huge load of crap, I can't even... lol
I swear, XIV fanboys get funnier by the day. Thanks for the laugh.
サーバ: Valefor
Game: FFXI
Posts: 19647
By Valefor.Prothescar 2021-11-27 14:45:11
"I don't have any actual fact to back up my made-up claims, let me sign off with a generic "haha, gotteem" and exit stage left"
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By Mattelot 2021-11-27 14:47:02
Literally EVERY SINGLE FFXIV poster who comes to the WoW forums, spews some huge load of crap that they read from Google without having any real knowledge of the game and gets called out for it replies with that exact same response. You could set your watch to it.
You're way over your head.
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サーバ: Valefor
Game: FFXI
Posts: 19647
By Valefor.Prothescar 2021-11-27 14:47:22
Two in a row, going for the big combo.
By Mattelot 2021-11-27 14:49:17
Going through the thread, I think you're 4 in a row.
I don't get it. What possesses someone to go out of their way to deliberately humiliate themselves on a public forum? I never understood that.
サーバ: Valefor
Game: FFXI
Posts: 19647
By Valefor.Prothescar 2021-11-27 14:49:45
You know, since you're so knowledgeable, and a grandmaster of the arts, you'd know that FFXIV has a publicly visible achievement system and some very, very visually distinct rewards for completing Ultimate fights. Surely it would be a simple task for someone as elite as you to show some evidence that you know what you're talking about.
Oh wait.
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By RadialArcana 2021-11-27 14:52:15
FF14 is made to be more casual to attract a different audience, it does what it does well enough and people like it.
As I posted in a previous post, both games are part of the same division so ultimately both games doing well is in the interest of Buisness Division 3.
By Mattelot 2021-11-27 14:54:53
FF14 is made to be more casual to attract a different audience, it does what it does well enough and people like it.
Correct.
Gamers today are a lot more lazy. And that's not a huge bad thing. Games that require a lot of thought are becoming less and less popular.
I've played MTG for almost 27 years and it's very uncommon to find people who think and build original ideas. Just about everyone now-a-days copies their ideas from other people who have succeeded.
Back to the Future II likely called it. One day... "you mean you have to use your hands!?"
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3113
By Asura.Aeonova 2021-11-27 14:58:25
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By Mattelot 2021-11-27 15:03:24
It never became a FFXIV vs WoW thread. Obysuca just asked about WoW difficulty and someone else mentioned how FFXIV's mechanics were taken from WoW, which isn't a huge secret. Nobody was bickering about the two together.
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Lakshmi.Cesil
サーバ: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 560
By Lakshmi.Cesil 2021-11-27 15:16:06
FF14 is made to be more casual to attract a different audience, it does what it does well enough and people like it.
As I posted in a previous post, both games are part of the same division so ultimately both games doing well is in the interest of Buisness Division 3.
Oddly enough I found FFXIV much more demanding of my time than FFXI. For FFXI, I log in if I want to do events that are fairly quick now (ambu, dynamis, omen, odyssey), my friends can beat the bosses in Odyssey in like...1-3 minutes. >.> Ambu, we just do 2-4 VD runs, that's a wrap and then dynamis, okay that one can be either quick or long depending on what we are doing. As for the new EXP that came out, yes that takes a while haha. Before that though was when I actually checked how much time I spent on each game.
Even when I started my alt on FFXI, it didn't nearly take as long as it does in FFXIV for me to bring my mule up to par with my current main (Got it a yagrush and everything). Tested that too haha.
For FFXIV, when I was actually raiding and playing seriously, I had to complete my tokens each week, if I missed a week, I'd miss out on an upgrade piece for my gear. I also had to do the raiding weekly, which took HOURS. Waiting for the group to log on, then actually defeating the raids for upgrades. When the raid is new, that is a lot of time spent doing them.
Once we got it down it went smoother, but I actually tested which game I ended up spending more time invested in when actually playing and getting stuff done. By far FFXIV took more of my time than FFXI. If I was going to go back to twitch to stream, I'd pick FFXIV because I spent way more time on that game doing everything haha. I did not find FFXIV casual at all, it was really time demanding (When I played the games to their fullest, doing end game content I mean, how I do endgame content in FFXI, and leveling alts)
Just my two cents, I am sure others have different experiences, but that is mine. :)
Ragnarok.Jessikah
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3833
By Ragnarok.Jessikah 2021-11-27 16:33:19
I'm with Cesil on this. The only way in which FFXI is really demanding for time is for long-term goals such as the upgrade path of a REMA. But none of it is demanded on the daily, nor does it require a time investment of 2-3 hours at a time.
Yes, early FFXI required a committed time slot of hours for the process of finding an experience party or for some big endgame run. But a lot of that has been gradually fixed, and only a few events still exist for that. And that's a healthy thing for an MMORPG to have.
Other games tend to have big lists of daily chores to take care of, that often feel like obligations because of their often juicy rewards. They demand you stay subscribed and spend minutes or even hours to max our your rewards. All of this leads to the feeling of the game being a job. I'm thankful FFXI doesn't do that.
サーバ: Valefor
Game: FFXI
Posts: 19647
By Valefor.Prothescar 2021-11-27 16:40:25
To be fair, FFXI does have that. It just doesn't necessarily hard gate your progression for missing an omen, odyssey, Dyna-D, RoE objective, ambuscade rewards, monthly deed, etc., but you will be at a huge disadvantage if you don't do your daily/weekly/monthly tasks. When I want to no-life in XI I feel like I need to spend as much or more time doing all of my daily entries, or capping ambu rewards every month, or doing my RoE busywork.
On the flipside, unless you want to be on the bleeding edge, you aren't compelled to cap your tomes every week in XIV, either. The catchup mechanics that roll out over the course of the 6 months leading from tier to tier ensure that you can casually get up to the next tier over time if you decide to take it slower.
I'd consider the two similar, personally.
Ragnarok.Ghishlain
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1081
By Ragnarok.Ghishlain 2021-11-27 16:56:27
Wow, the anti-FFXIV stupidity is real..
Honestly, I should just listen to this:
Valefor.Prothescar said: »I swore off engaging with people like you on here because it is often pointless
With that being said.. *Deep breath*
Breaking down FFXIV into "smash 1,2,3 and avoid telegraphs" is like saying "Use Savage Blade in your TP set until the boss is dead".
There's a lot of nuance to FFXIV that isn't in the itemization, it's in understanding the fight mechanics and understanding how to optimize for that fight to maximize your DPS. Every job in XIV has a different optimized rotation that you have to mesh into the boss fight timeline for maximum efficiency. This requires a player to understand the fight through and through and adjust their rotation to suit the fight for maximum damage. I.E., Paladin opening with their magic rotation first instead of their physical rotation can allow them to have their movement tech up during heavy mechanical portions of the fight so they don't lose a significant chunk of their DPS. AST holding and coordinating their buffs with NIN's Trick Attacks can optimize raid DPS - and then by extension holding their raid buffs if the boss is about to go invulnerable. A lot of the optimization in XIV is nuanced into the boss fights themselves and require a lot of time to get intimate with the fight to understand it - it's not too different from pouring hours into optimizing your XI gear sets except your optimizing your actions for the individual fight mechanics.
In the end, it's clear XI and XIV are built to be incredibly different games and comparing the two is really stupid since each is designed with a different player base in mind.
By Chaplin 2021-11-27 17:10:10
Why is it always people who never really accomplished much or bought their accounts who are so pro 14? Interesting correlation.
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サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 127
By Asura.Skyekitty 2021-11-27 17:23:37
I think the real issue with settling this debate is that from either side, anything that can be considered "strategic", to use that word from previous posts, can be watered down into a simple statement, then argued.
FFXI: Savage Blade till win.
FFXIV: Key Mash and avoid Red Lines.
Doesn't matter how much more complicated or detailed you want to get into proof of strategy on either game. Someone will reduce it down to simple statements and use that as a counter argument.
Long cat is long because not short.
Why use lot word when few word do trick?
What's good about FFXI is probably the memories and nostalgia that brings you (me) back to the game. I need that sweet hit of memories for my feel good moments. I "grew up" with the game and because it is still true to its roots (not like WOW for example) I get that hit every time I resub after taking a break and I LOVE that.
I wish the game was as popular as it was back in Aht Urghan days, but I'll settle with it still being alive and kicking.
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 127
By Asura.Skyekitty 2021-11-27 17:25:35
That being said, I am still camping Bugbear Strongman for 8 hours for my last kill and it hasn't popped. Another lovely nugget FFXI has to offer. Sweet pain!
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Ragnarok.Ghishlain
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1081
By Ragnarok.Ghishlain 2021-11-27 18:04:10
I think the real issue with settling this debate is that from either side, anything that can be considered "strategic", to use that word from previous posts, can be watered down into a simple statement, then argued.
FFXI: Savage Blade till win.
FFXIV: Key Mash and avoid Red Lines.
Doesn't matter how much more complicated or detailed you want to get into proof of strategy on either game. Someone will reduce it down to simple statements and use that as a counter argument.
Long cat is long because not short.
Why use lot word when few word do trick?
That is indeed a problem and is extremely disingenuous to the game in question when it is simplified to that extreme. And this is true to both FFXIV and FFXI.
In the end, probably be best to push the "hate FFXIV train" off the tracks and put the "love FFXI train" back onto the tracks, like you are already doing.
I miss doing Legion, despite how dumb the content was at the time, lol. It was fun being a solo WHM in an 18-man content. The hectic-ness of it was nice, but now I definitely could not keep up with anything like that.
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Ragnarok.Jessikah
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3833
By Ragnarok.Jessikah 2021-11-27 18:22:39
XI and XIV are both simple and complicated in their own ways. That's why players of both games tend to think the other is braindead.
For example, FFXI simplifies white damage into autoattacks rather than using GCDs. Yet it complicates the healing process by having status ailments and forcing a healer to choose between (for example) using Silena or Cure in a split second.
My preference is for the things which XI simplifies and complicates, but that is an entirely subjective opinion.
I can think of more reasons that I don't like XIV, but to say it is "braindead" is not an objective fact. Not to mention that is not relevant to this discussion.
Asura.Saevel
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9910
By Asura.Saevel 2021-11-27 18:23:20
Ragnarok.Ghishlain said: »In the end, probably be best to push the "hate FFXIV train" off the tracks and put the "love FFXI train" back onto the tracks, like you are already doing.
Well on this note. I just made an new character on my main account and have been leveling them as thought I was a new player. So far it's been a blast, am at level 32 and now going to Kahzam for more XP :D.
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By Draylo 2021-11-27 19:06:36
XIV is garbage. You are on a forum primarily for XI, stop expecting people to like that game here or demand its respected, especially since it's the direct reason for this games decline.
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By Draylo 2021-11-27 19:15:00
Why is it always people who never really accomplished much or bought their accounts who are so pro 14? Interesting correlation.
Or people who got bored with XI or jaded due to some reason, they want to force themselves to love that game. There is probably a reason you force yourself to like that. As time goes on and XI gets less and less support from the company, you'll just see more people bored or jaded that will go to XIV and force themselves to like it and think its the next coming of christ or something. Why didn't all of them play WoW from the start if it was such incredible gameplay? That is exactly what they were playing for ages, I still remember all the XI players scoffing at WoW and its gameplay all over these forums, and now that it has a FF skin with emotes and shop items, its somehow accepted.
Also that Ultimate/Savage crap is something like 1% of the population even attempts and finishes. It is completely unfun, where you are forced to memorize entire fight scripts and bash your head against the wall while all 8 people complete it. If that is your idea of fun, then sure go for it. To me, having to memorize all that crap and then hope the other 7 people do too as you spend hours dying over and over to the mechanics until it clicks, too much. I can't think of one FF game that functions in that way.
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Ragnarok.Jessikah
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3833
By Ragnarok.Jessikah 2021-11-27 20:10:49
You are on a forum primarily for XI, stop expecting people to like that game here or demand its respect It's also just straight-up hard to say what makes FFXI a good game without comparing it to other games in the genre. And given that WoW began a formula that nearly every MMORPG has followed since, (including XIV) that's what we're inevitably going to compare it against.
I've said it before, but a lot of what's being said in this topic is against the common formula, and not necessarily XIV. If the XIV fans get defensive over it, it's their own admission that the complaints are a part of that game.
Granted, some people are using this thread as means to just bash the crap out of XIV. Regardless, that's where Draylo's comment weighs in. I'm sure most of us have tried XIV at this point. A lot of us are here specifically because we prefer XI. If anyone comes in with anti-XI comments, it's a fair assumption that it will be met in kind...
Ragnarok.Ghishlain
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1081
By Ragnarok.Ghishlain 2021-11-27 20:18:39
XIV is garbage. You are on a forum primarily for XI, stop expecting people to like that game here or demand its respected, especially since it's the direct reason for this games decline.
Why is it always people who never really accomplished much or bought their accounts who are so pro 14? Interesting correlation.
Or people who got bored with XI or jaded due to some reason, they want to force themselves to love that game. There is probably a reason you force yourself to like that. As time goes on and XI gets less and less support from the company, you'll just see more people bored or jaded that will go to XIV and force themselves to like it and think its the next coming of christ or something. Why didn't all of them play WoW from the start if it was such incredible gameplay? That is exactly what they were playing for ages, I still remember all the XI players scoffing at WoW and its gameplay all over these forums, and now that it has a FF skin with emotes and shop items, its somehow accepted.
Also that Ultimate/Savage crap is something like 1% of the population even attempts and finishes. It is completely unfun, where you are forced to memorize entire fight scripts and bash your head against the wall while all 8 people complete it. If that is your idea of fun, then sure go for it. To me, having to memorize all that crap and then hope the other 7 people do too as you spend hours dying over and over to the mechanics until it clicks, too much. I can't think of one FF game that functions in that way.
No one is really demanding for FFXIV to be respected. There is a discussion about stop being ignorant about how XIV works because it has it's own level of complexity that directly contrasts FFXI complexity. It's not that different from asking for the XIV fans to stop being ignorant on how XI works as a whole either.
Different strokes for different folks. Everyone has their opinion on things. We can have a mature discussion without resorting to name calling or disrespectful banter.
But hey, I'll bite again too. I'm not going to speak to what you define as "fun" and "unfun" as that is entirely subjective and I find there are fun aspects to both XI and XIV.
I will say that claiming only 1% of the population attempts Savage/Ultimate content is faculty wrong and here's the evidence:
Here are the clear rates for Savage content this tier as of July, 2021
The right most column of this table indicates the total % of that server's population that has cleared the final tier of Savage. The 4th column indicates the total active players on the server by parsing the Lodestone for those who have a specific mount or minion (I believe). The second right most column indicates the total number of players who cleared the final tier of Savage, based on the amount of people who have the mount from that fight.
That's clearly over 1%
Ultimate Clear Rates for The Epic of Alexander as of July 5th, 2021:
Data is parsed from the number of clears reported on FFLogs and compared to the active number of players listed in the previous table.
That's also clearly over 1%
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Before you go "but that's clearly not accurate data", I'd be curious if anyone has an accurate and meaningful way of measuring the amount of content players have cleared the hardest XI content. FFXIAH lists 89,923 active players currently. I'd imagine that % to be higher than Savage / Ultimate clears on XIV because only the really dedicated players are still left on XI. It would be a fun comparison to make for discussion.
Anyway, I think it's only proper that S-E pushes their attention and focus onto XIV and not XI. It sucks, but XI as a game is not appealing to how the gamer market has shifted. There are a few new generations of gamers now and XI is almost a 20 year old game that was marketed and designed with a significantly different market. It makes good business sense to focus more attention on the game that will generally see a higher return on investment.
I also personally attribute XIV 1.0's failure to the fact that S-E tried to push XI 2.0 in the form of XIV 1.0 and it failed miserably. After playing XIV 1.0 myself, I basically said "why the heck do I want to play something that tries to be like FFXI when I can just play FFXI?" and then promptly moved back to XI and continued to play XI instead. I think at that point, S-E recognized they couldn't really have two similar versions of a MMO and be successful as they would just be gouging their own game for player - so they shifted to a game play style that was more appealing to the current market and now we have XIV as we currently do.
And before anyone tries to claim that I haven't accomplished anything on XI - I completed Legion and Delve while it was relevant. I wrote an entire guide on how to play WHM on XI back when I was active. And I also cleared the most recent Savage tier in FFXIV as well. I'm pretty certain I can speak on good authority about the pros and cons of both games.
Anyway, I also apologize for heavily derailing this thread.
By Draylo 2021-11-27 20:25:02
Yeah yet if that was the case they should have created every game to be like candy crush, fortnite and LoL. Yet they didn't and they see artistic value in different styles of games or remastering older projects. They don't have to necessarily create or support only the games that are going to make them money and they've shown multiple times that it isn't their sole objective given how many remasters of games they've done that have generally mediocre sales.
Also keep in mind your precious XIV is almost 12 years old, its no youngling. They are actively gouging one of their previous most profitable MMO and doing so in favor of supporting XIV. I can't count how many ads and money that has been thrown at that game, it would be a surprise if it didn't do well given how much they've invested. If only they invested 1% of that back into XI.
By Chaplin 2021-11-27 20:31:24
Isn’t FFlogs that site there was a big thing on their forums about people reporting false information on?
Ragnarok.Jessikah
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3833
By Ragnarok.Jessikah 2021-11-27 20:39:55
Ragnarok.Ghishlain said: »I also personally attribute XIV 1.0's failure to the fact that S-E tried to push XI 2.0 in the form of XIV 1.0 and it failed miserably. After playing XIV 1.0 myself, I basically said "why the heck do I want to play something that tries to be like FFXI when I can just play FFXI?" and then promptly moved back to XI and continued to play XI instead. I think at that point, S-E recognized they couldn't really have two similar versions of a MMO and be successful as they would just be gouging their own game for player - so they shifted to a game play style that was more appealing to the current market and now we have XIV as we currently do I've heard this before. XIV 1.0 didn't fail because it tried to be XI-2, XIV 1.0 failed because it was a hot pile of steaming garbage. It had no idea what made a good game good. In fact, I kept notes from just my few hours playing it extremely early on.
To summarize my initial notes:
The UI was awful (it was hard to read and didn't update in real-time). There was no central marketplace (Auction House). There existed no way at all to look for a party. Outdoor zones had nothing to do, and like 1 monster per square mile (I wrote down "PC's literally camp everyday monsters like they were NMs"). Soloing was anywhere between 2x to 5x faster than partying because of the experience systems in place. Archers couldn't reload in the middle of combat, and running out of ammo guaranteed death. The game was broken - I had glitches listed as unable to attack or put your weapon away, you wouldn't revive if you chose to return to your home point while KOed. The chat log was static. Character creation was even more limited than XI. Camera was poorly designed. Players were penalized for playing over time by gradually lowering earned experience points to as low as 0, only gradually returning to normal while logged-out.
And that's just the tip of the iceberg.
I know people who say that XIV sucked because it had TP, and because XI has TP as a resource, that must mean that it sucks as well. No. XIV just didn't know how to do TP. It included TP as an execution requirement in addition to having GCDs, which was a really, really stupid way to do it. But because the game got better as a result of removing TP, a lot of people think XI is just "behind the times" or some crap. It's really annoying.
By llAKs0nll 2021-11-27 20:58:50
It’s inevitable comparing 11 to 14 since what’s Good about FFXI is that FFXI is NOT WoW while 14 is
Things I think are good about FFXI, people tend to ask why are you still playing that game so I thought I would write some things down.
Basics: I like that I can play any job on one character, this instills a greater connection with your character and a greater feeling of community because people are always on that character, so you always see them on it. The gear swapping system is great for many different reasons, from the aspect of adding some complexity to play to just having so much gear to chase. I like the skillchain/MB system, that is still relevant today at near all levels of play. I like that the game has a massive wealth of different things to do and they are all deep enough to get involved in them, crafting, mog garden, pet rearing, monstrosity etc. It's so annoying to me when I find a game I really like and it's 90% just dungeon variation spamming.
1. No Cash shop (muh "optional" items), I know exactly how much I'm spending on FFXI and I can't spend anymore. The issue with playing an MMMORPG is that you spend large amounts of time in these games, and it's very easy to spend money on "optional items". You think you would not cause you're good with money, but you will and you can spend a lot. You get attached to your characters, you're feeling tired and mentally worn down after playing for 4-5 hours, it's 1am, you're bored and there is that fancy $30 mount you just saw someone run past you. Cash shops are predatory and the company manipulates you, you're not immune. On FFXI it's not "optional" at all, they don't have one.
1a. I like the subscription only model, not only for the reason above and because it creates a kind of unwritten contract where they make content regularly (I have another f2p game I enjoy but they very rarely add anything new at all, and it's infuriating because I do spend money on it) but also because paying a monthly sub encourages you to actually play the game. I have lots of f2p games installed that I can play any time I want to, I never play them because there is no mental imperative to do so.
2. I fit into the community in the game cause they are near all over 25+, I don't like playing games with a social foundation where I feel completely out of place. On games like Overwatch or whatever it doesn't matter, you're just shooting people but these games are community based. Not to say everyone on 11 acts like a civlized individual or anything but it's trolling, drama or jokes that gel with me and that I'm used to. Talking of which, you can actually tell jokes or be a troll/drama queen free from being banned for hurting somebodies feelings. The GMs ignore most reports about silly issues like this and just tell you to blist, cause the developers set these rules down long ago before current culture took over. Many modern MMORPGs are played by people who were brought up on social media, they think everything is toxic and many modern games are simply fake friendly because of fear of being banned.
2a) I like that due to the nature of the party building system, some of the most highly respected players of this game are the party builders. People who make groups and become admired for not only doing this but doing it well and being very knowledgeable. On modern games there would be no status in this, because it isn't needed.
2b) I like that the game still tries to force players to interact with others to a greater or lesser degree, there are still roadblocks like mission fights, gear unlocks or whatever where you have to reach out to others. Even new players can be totally lost in how to play and ask for help, and people can and do offer it. It's good that players are still the most important force in the game world, when you need help other players are there and not some UI button to insta match you with others. It actually does feel good to reach out for help and someone to send a tell and offer to help you with something you've been struggling with for hours or days, even if it's harder to get that help in the first place.
In my first year of playing I was on the verge of quitting, because I could not get my limit break 1 item in Eldieme. I played completely solo as a BST and so had nobody to ask for help, upto this point I could do everything alone so needed nobody. I struggled for 2 days and died over and over (I even had to go relevel and come back and keep trying), even if I did manage to down a Lich with my weak jug pets and reraise / dia the drop rate was so bad it seemed impossible. At the point of near just giving up a 75 BST checked me and sent me an invite, he spent an hour getting me my item and i remember feeling guilty he was wasting so much time on me. That simple action that really probably meant very little to him, changed my entire outlook on ffxi. I felt as if I was part of a community after that, the next day I carried on leveling WHM and would spend a lot of time helping other players (eventually on my main BST 75 too, wanting to do for others what he had done for me). I went from a complete solo player not caring about helping anyone to spending almost all of my time outside of a XP parties doing just that. Even today, FFXI still has this system in place for different things and most other games do not.
3. I like the way the auction house works, I like the economy where inflation and supply/demand are actually a thing and how everyone is interlinked more than on other games. I like that gil has real value for players and that to make gil you mostly have to get it from other players, farming items they want.
4. There is always something to do when you login. FFXI has so many long term goals and things to do that it's near impossible to have nothing to do when you login, on most modern mmorpgs you quickly run out of things to do becasue they are all aimed at casual players that complain about "grind" or "not respecting your time". As such they make the games now to appeal to non-mmorpgs players and I'm an mmorpg player.
5. I like that your server is your entire world and there is nothing outside of that. When I group up with some people, help some random person/get help or even just wandering around doing my own thing, I'll see the same names around all the time and I'll remember them from previous encounters. This promotes a heavy feeling of familiarity in your game world and world building, when I login and wander my home nation especially it feels good. It feels like "home" because I see the same people and have for years. When you play modern games you're mostly always playing with people off server, as such you're very aware you will never see this person ever again. So you have zero incentive to bother with them and they are instantly forgotten.
6. I like that the game does not tell you what to do at every moment, or that it's not completely linear (do this endgame, then this, then this in that order etc). Leveling is very open, endgame content has lots of routes to your goal (and those goals can be different).
7. I like that the game has long-term goals as standard. Whether it's getting +2 Ambuscade gear as a solo player, REMA or working on serious endgame gear with groups. Modern games are so afraid of people getting bored and quitting that everything is easy and short term. The problem with this is that gratification delayed is gratification magnified, so you will never get the immense feeling of gratification from anything on a modern mmorpg that you will get from achieving your goals on FFXI.
I remember none of the gear I obtained on most modern MMORPGS I've played, because it was easy to get and quickly replaced anyway. I remember every major piece of gear I've obtained on FFXI because I had to work hard to get them and there was emotion linked to that, from my Byakkos Haidate, Kirins Osode, getting my first Relic with the help of my linkshell, Dalmatica, my first Ambsucade +2 set after returning, completing malignance set etc.
8. I like that the game has more or less horizontal progression, there is always gear to go work for to improve but they don't wipe out your entire gear sets every 6-12 months. If you take a break for a year and come back, your gear is still good. Remember what they did with Abyssea with gear and how everyone was so mad? modern mmorpgs do that every major patch.
9. I like that they allow you to become really strong at endgame and that there is so much upgrade potential on your character (get to 99, get merits, get job points, get lots of gear etc), if you put a lot of work in it will show and you can become a beast. This is unlike most games where everyone is near enough the same and the cap is low to stop anyone feeling inferior. On FFXI the effort you put into your char/gear is significant and the game allows you to excel.
9a) I like that knowledge is important and you can't just overpower everything. For instance that Lillith can spike you to death and you need to turn, that a darkness skillchain heals her or how charm works etc. FFXI rewards hard work and knowledge, and that knowledge is figured out by the players and shared.
10. I like that FFXI does not have a single set of gear that you never take off, they have a macro system that lets you swap every piece of gear based on the situation or what you want to do. This means, you don't just work to get 6 pieces of BIS armor and a weapon and are done. You can get vast amounts of gear and swap between them. This builds into the "always something to do" system since there is so much gear to get.
11. I like the way the combat works, on most mmorpgs they have rotations of skills. So you're constantly pressing 1, 2, 3, 4 etc over and over forever. I hate this kind of busy work, because most of the time I'm doing casual stuff like farming or doing some daily activities while watching a movie. I feel like I'm wearing out my keys on most mmorpgs. Pressing 6 keys is no better than pressing 2 if the outcome is the same, it's just about fooling you into thinking you're doing something skilled when you're not. The combat also speeds up when it needs to (when you have buff jobs boosting you etc), and not always the same. Something else I'm really glad does not exist on XI is telegraphing, although this can be fun these games tend to overuse it and it becomes boring and very annoying. I don't want to endlessly move out of circles or red boxes while playing.
12. I like that the game has proper varied jobs that fill specific roles, for instance a healer is a proper healer and your job is -keep everyone alive- and that's it. There are pure buff jobs that exist just to buff the damage dealers, this is near unheard of in modern games. You can actually run out of MP if your gear is poor or you're playing poorly, the tank can lose aggro easily or a DD can miss a skill if you don't gear or play correctly. Modern mmorpgs make all jobs easy to play and very similar so no matter what job you're on, you're pretty much playing the same role and/or have to be really bad to fail to play it effectively.
13. I like that the jobs are allowed to be different and have strengths and weaknesses, I like that some jobs are far stronger than others for pure damage and that some jobs are situationally better than others. The jobs all actually feel really different and have different uses. Some jobs like BLU are incredibly fun and rewarding, you can change how the job plays or what spells it can use (blue can be pure DD, cure, crowd control, AOE murder etc) based on which spells you equip. Summoner on FFXI is fantastic, the avatars all look great and it's very powerful.
13a) I like that there is far more customization with your jobs on FFXI than on many other games, ultimately you do still end up fitting in with the meta but there is still a lot of customization possibility than you are allowed on other games. Subjobs, gear, weapon choices etc.
14. The endgame content is very unpredictable and can be very difficult (unless you're geared out the butt). I like that failing has consequences and doesn't just warp you back to the front of the boss to try again, when you have nothing to lose winning feels hollow. When I came back a few years ago, I struggled so hard with Zitah NMs. Beating my first one after failing many tries felt so good. To most others it's nothing, but to me it was a major victory and FFXI is full of things like this.
14a) I like how endgame isn't just directly linked to spamming different dungeons over and over, there are so many different things you can go do that have meaning. There is also far less stress put upon you to be doing specific things, when I play modern mmorpgs I very much do end up just spamming dungeons in group finder over and over all day. I very much do feel pressure to be doing that too.
15. I like that leveling isn't via stupid mini story quests that you never read anyway. I like that they just give you kill count quests and do away with the pretense that you care about "Fred Jones the hunter needs 10 rat tails or his house will be repossessed by captain crunch, can you help them brave adventurer?" "ok"
16. I like the crafting system, not only is it very difficult to cap out but it's very useful and linked to the economy. It also gives avenues of long progression if you choose to follow them. Sub-crafts, sheilds, knowledge of how to make profits etc
17. I like multiboxing, this is a niche enjoyment but I really like that I can not only multibox without having 4 computers but that the gameplay supports you doing it without automating everything, cause it does not have rotations etc. On other games I tend to make lots of alts and end up swapping between them for dailies, on FFXI I can have them all logged in at the same time and doing stuff. It does give an oldschool FF feel to me in some ways.
18. I like the customization via windower addons, the limitaitons of the UI was the mother of invention here and so we have all these things that a game with a more modern UI would never have.
19. I love the game world and how the developers encourage you to explore it and also to goto certain places to do content and not just let you warp into whatever form wherever (if you wanna do Amb you goto Mhuara, if you wanna do Ody you goto Rabao etc), I love how there is a nice mix or open/instanced/dungeon content, I love the deep lore where you can find things out years later that you never knew while doing the missions, I love the stories (even if many are bittersweet), I love the respect the developers have for the game world. Vana'diel feels like a real place to me in many ways, and this is not only for the things above but also because of the community aspects I mentioned earlier in the post too.
20. I personally like that near everything can be modded on FFXI, it's almost like a mini Skyrim in many ways. Not only from the perspective of making your own mods but using others mods.
21. I like how the game scales to the players and there are different paths, one person can be working on Ambu +2 gear as their long-term endgame goals when they login every day and another can be grinding out Gaol gear/upgrades. Everyone isn't just doing the same thing, and you can be a more casual player with less elite goals and be fine with that.
22. I like the music style, I like the overall aesthetic, character and monster designs. It's not stylized in a way that alienates people, it's not overly flashy and gaudy. A huge turnoff for me with 14 is the anime music style, art style, overly gaudy flashy OTT effects etc
23. I like that the game will not be replacing pictures of mithra with bowls of fruit or pandering to modern day SJW issues, the developers just want to make content and not push an agenda.
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