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What's good about FFXI.
Asura.Saevel
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9910
By Asura.Saevel 2021-11-27 21:31:39
Ragnarok.Jessikah said: »Granted, some people are using this thread as means to just bash the crap out of XIV. Regardless, that's where Draylo's comment weighs in. I'm sure most of us have tried XIV at this point. A lot of us are here specifically because we prefer XI. If anyone comes in with anti-XI comments, it's a fair assumption that it will be met in kind...
Done Ever Quest, Earth and Beyond, FFXI, WoW, DDO, FFXIV and a few others that I didn't stick around with. Currently it's mostly DDO and XI with the occasional vacation into XIV for a different feel. Every game has a different flavor and style that caters to a different crowd. To really get where this is coming from we need to understand Bartels Taxonomy.
Part 1
Bartle's Taxonomy
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Part 2
Balancing MMO's with the Taxonomy in mind
YouTube Video Placeholder
No reasonable discussion of "me say game X good" or "me say game Y bad" can happen without those two videos being understood due to folks emotions causing them to talk around each other.
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Ragnarok.Ghishlain
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1081
By Ragnarok.Ghishlain 2021-11-27 22:00:08
Yeah yet if that was the case they should have created every game to be like candy crush, fortnite and LoL. Yet they didn't and they see artistic value in different styles of games or remastering older projects. They don't have to necessarily create or support only the games that are going to make them money and they've shown multiple times that it isn't their sole objective given how many remasters of games they've done that have generally mediocre sales.
Also keep in mind your precious XIV is almost 12 years old, its no youngling. They are actively gouging one of their previous most profitable MMO and doing so in favor of supporting XIV. I can't count how many ads and money that has been thrown at that game, it would be a surprise if it didn't do well given how much they've invested. If only they invested 1% of that back into XI.
If I were to take a guess, remastering a 2D RPG and implementing previously scrapped content isn't that large of an endeavor.
But given how expensive FFXI as a game is, re-mastering the entire game is no small journey and will definitely take time and money to do. Who knows, maybe they are doing that for the 20th anniversary surprise that is to come. Only S-E would know.
I do find it funny that S-E is testing the idea of a MOBA-style game with First Soldier - I anticipate that to be a pretty hard flop but I will admit I have no interest in trying it myself.
And yeah, XIV is a 12 year old game technically, but given the massive graphical and engine overhaul it received, it would be better to view XIV at the time 2.0 was released which is August 2013, making it closer to a 8 year old game. Still old and it's definitely showing it's age, I won't doubt that. Things like the glamour system is terrible and the netcode leaves a lot to desire. Also need more storage too and the housing in the game is atrocious. The game is certainly not without faults so it's certainly not "my precious" FFXIV, so please drop the condensation and putting words in my mouth. I enjoy the game like I enjoy XI.
Ragnarok.Jessikah said: »Ragnarok.Ghishlain said: »I also personally attribute XIV 1.0's failure to the fact that S-E tried to push XI 2.0 in the form of XIV 1.0 and it failed miserably. After playing XIV 1.0 myself, I basically said "why the heck do I want to play something that tries to be like FFXI when I can just play FFXI?" and then promptly moved back to XI and continued to play XI instead. I think at that point, S-E recognized they couldn't really have two similar versions of a MMO and be successful as they would just be gouging their own game for player - so they shifted to a game play style that was more appealing to the current market and now we have XIV as we currently do I've heard this before. XIV 1.0 didn't fail because it tried to be XI-2, XIV 1.0 failed because it was a hot pile of steaming garbage. It had no idea what made a good game good. In fact, I kept notes from just my few hours playing it extremely early on.
To summarize my initial notes:
The UI was awful (it was hard to read and didn't update in real-time). There was no central marketplace (Auction House). There existed no way at all to look for a party. Outdoor zones had nothing to do, and like 1 monster per square mile (I wrote down "PC's literally camp everyday monsters like they were NMs"). Soloing was anywhere between 2x to 5x faster than partying because of the experience systems in place. Archers couldn't reload in the middle of combat, and running out of ammo guaranteed death. The game was broken - I had glitches listed as unable to attack or put your weapon away, you wouldn't revive if you chose to return to your home point while KOed. The chat log was static. Character creation was even more limited than XI. Camera was poorly designed. Players were penalized for playing over time by gradually lowering earned experience points to as low as 0, only gradually returning to normal while logged-out.
And that's just the tip of the iceberg.
I know people who say that XIV sucked because it had TP, and because XI has TP as a resource, that must mean that it sucks as well. No. XIV just didn't know how to do TP. It included TP as an execution requirement in addition to having GCDs, which was a really, really stupid way to do it. But because the game got better as a result of removing TP, a lot of people think XI is just "behind the times" or some crap. It's really annoying.
Yeah, in general, it's safe to say XIV 1.0 was just a terrible mess at too many things. For me, another issue was also the computer power needed to play it. My rig wasn't that great at the time so it was a chunky mess to play, which also sapped the enjoyment. Combine that with all the bugs and glitches you listed and it was just a downright mess.
While I didn't play any 1.0, I have spoken with players who played till the end of the 1.X saga. A lot of these players do agree that FFXIV 1.X did start to make it's stride in the latter half, implementing a ton of QoLs and adjustments that made the game significantly more enjoyable and actually felt like it was worth playing. I guess that was until someone decided to hit the Bahamut Nuke button and give us what 2.0 is today.
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3113
By Asura.Aeonova 2021-11-27 22:11:19
Ragnarok.Ghishlain said: »it's safe to say XIV 1.0 was just a terrible mess
At least everyone can come together on some things.
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Ragnarok.Jessikah
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3833
By Ragnarok.Jessikah 2021-11-27 22:14:00
Done Ever Quest, Earth and Beyond, FFXI, WoW, DDO, FFXIV and a few others that I didn't stick around with. Currently it's mostly DDO and XI with the occasional vacation into XIV for a different feel. Every game has a different flavor and style that caters to a different crowd. To really get where this is coming from we need to understand Bartels Taxonomy. That was an interesting watch. I've always liked Extra Credits, I don't know why I don't watch more of their stuff.
From watching that, I think internally I can *** myself as an Explorer/Socializer. I couldn't care less about achievements or "winning" against others. FFXI allows me to express all of that by being very PvE focused and allowing for a fairly stable player-centric economy.
But I definitely just like to muck about with the world, and I've always loved helping new players when I can.
Asura.Saevel
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9910
By Asura.Saevel 2021-11-27 22:25:33
Ragnarok.Ghishlain said: »While I didn't play any 1.0, I have spoken with players who played till the end of the 1.X saga. A lot of these players do agree that FFXIV 1.X did start to make it's stride in the latter half, implementing a ton of QoLs and adjustments that made the game significantly more enjoyable and actually felt like it was worth playing. I guess that was until someone decided to hit the Bahamut Nuke button and give us what 2.0 is today.
Was one of the folks from XI who got to do the beta stuff and most of those aforementioned bugs were identified during that time. Lots (not all) were fixed when 1.0 was officially opened. 1.0 failed hard due to mechanical issues Tanaka had implemented that culminated in the game not actually wanting players to play it. That was communicated during beta feedback but got soundly ignored by the big guy, so even when they fixed the bugs and had some QoL updates, the core issues remained until SE brass decided to scrap it, send Tanaka to manage a broom closet, and rebuild the game.
See SE has takes huge issue with any of the numbered "Final Fantasy" games being perceived as a "failure". So when FFXIV 1.0 tanked and had so much negative press, they removed the guy responsible (Tanaka), moved the guy doing Dragon Quest (Yoshida) and had him take charge of not having a main series game be a failure. This also involved having Matsui, who was temporarily running FFXI while Tanaka was screwing up FFXIV, redo the combat system for FFXIV. Matsui later got promoted to be the producer of FFXI and the guy running the combat team for FFXIV.
Yeah imagine that, the current XI producer is also the person doing all those cool fights that folks love in FFXIV. All the folks attempting to hate on FFXIV's combat system are just spiting in their own eyes.
By Draylo 2021-11-27 22:32:26
Or simply they don't like the battle system and in their opinion its garbage, imagine that someone having a different opinion.
By llAKs0nll 2021-11-27 22:40:02
Ragnarok.Ghishlain said: »it's safe to say XIV 1.0 was just a terrible mess
At least everyone can come together on some things.
Never tried 1.0 but it looks more like 11 which is want I wanted.
Honestly……..
I absolutely hate FFXIV cuz I know what killed off FFXI and when FFXI is done & over w/ and only FFXIV remains.
Was it seriously worth it cloning WoW?
Not IMO it wasn’t. If I wanted to play WoW that badly I wouldn’t had started playing 11 to begin w/
Asura.Saevel
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9910
By Asura.Saevel 2021-11-27 23:39:41
I think we found who made the socks.
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By Draylo 2021-11-27 23:50:44
lol it looks like mine but it isn't, I don't care enough to make socks
By llAKs0nll 2021-11-28 02:32:17
I think we found who made the socks.
When FFXIV was 1st announced we were told that FFXI and FFXIV would be inter connected. You could walk into your Mog in 11 and walk out into 14. That’s the whole reason why 14 has the same Characters such as Taru & Mithra in the game in the 1st place. Then after whatever occurred during 14 development SE obviously ended up canceling such ideas. Then not long after we were eventually told 11 would no longer receive any major Updates only small Patches. So I mean yeah.
Remake FFXI correctly next time. Just cuz whatever they had going so far wasn’t up to par. That doesn’t mean they should had converted 14 into WoW w/ FFXI characters.
By llAKs0nll 2021-11-28 02:42:37
When FFXIV was 1st announced we were told that FFXI and FFXIV would be inter connected. You could walk into your Mog in 11 and walk out into 14. You got a source for this? there is no way in hell this was ever planned.
XIV didn't kill XI. People got tired of playing it and moved on. Shocker, I know. But if it makes you feel better then keep blaming Yoshida and the XIV boogeyman.
It was definitely during Dev discussions. SE never used Taru & Mithras until FFXI. No other FF game had such Races. There is no reason for them to exist in FFXIV other than via Dev Discussions claiming 11 connecting to 14.
You’re talking Dev discussions from 10+ years ago now?
No, I don’t have links. I tried searching but cannot find what I know I was discussing amongst LS atm way back then.
It’s not a coincidence that Taru & Mithras exist in 14. I know why they do.
By llAKs0nll 2021-11-28 02:58:43
Cuz yeah, Square Enix never reuses assets ever.
The only Characters they reuse repeated nonstop are Brigs, Wedge and Cid whom are in almost all games just like Chocobo and Moogles are but certainly not Tarutaru nor Mithras.
You will not find FFXII animal Characters in any other Game. You will not find Vivi from FFIX in any other game neither.
That’s not how SE makes NEW Final Fantasy games.
They literally NEVER use the same Race of Characters other than basic generic Humans. Possibly FF Tactics linked w/ FFXII though iirc far as Races & Planet go but other than that nothing else.
I promise you that is indeed the reason behind such.
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By llAKs0nll 2021-11-28 03:31:37
You will not FFXII animal Characters in any other Game. You will not find Vivi from FFIX in any other game neither. Vivi was in Kingdom Hearts II, a summon in FF Dimensions II and a racer in Chocobo GP. Viera are a playable race in XIV (Males being added in the upcoming expansion) and FF Tactics Advance and A2
Cross Games. Not in FF1 + also in FF3. I mentioned such w/ FF Tactics and FFXII doing such but never from one FF game to the next FF game.
Regardless I been searching as much as possible to find reference to my claims. I know myself & others were discussing such way back when but I can’t seem to find anything other than SE allowing FFXI players to port over FFXI character names to FFXIV but w/ last names being their Server name on FFXI.
サーバ: Valefor
Game: FFXI
Posts: 139
By Valefor.Furyspawn 2021-11-28 04:19:46
Skill chains and magic bursts as a specific subset of the mechanical complexity are one of the things I appreciate the most about XI, but it's really the overarching system that ties everything together, where the elements determine monster strengths/weaknesses, the affinity of abilities, traits, and base stats, the color of the moon during the week, the auto sorting order of spirits (elemental wheel) versus avatars (days of the week), and so much more.
Even if seemingly very few people can or do take advantage of it anymore, the game offers the opportunity for people to establish a synergy to complete content with style and grace in a way that is very fulfilling to me personally.
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By RadialArcana 2021-11-28 04:32:20
I dunno whos sock llAKs0nll is but he did a good job of riling you guys up, which was obv the intention he registered for.
By Draylo 2021-11-28 05:32:06
Except XIV thumpers have been hating on and bashing XI since 1.0... I have been around the forums a long time and have seen that over and over lol. I rarely, if ever, see someone pro XI go to an XIV forum and bash their game, but it happens constantly here and this was suppose to be a positive thread for XI. The problem is, both really cant exist in a healthy state thanks to SE.
We already have seen them take funds from this game to pour into 14 when it first failed. Now we see the people running to be apart of the cool club in a "modern" and popular game. The company themselves have poured endless money into advertising it and they barely throw this game a bone. I dont care its old, WoW is ancient too and so are many other MMO that still get full support.
I think its pretty easy to see why people are jaded towards XIV. Not to mention the discussion just now was based on its battle system which not everyone is going to like. People bashed WoW heavily on these forums for similar and now they are all pro XIV? Doesnt make sense but here we are. We pay a full sub fee just like them and get only a fraction of the companies time and energy. Then like many others have already said, they are two completely different games in gameplay, so they dont want to play it but are being forced as its the only other FF MMO.
All I said was, dont be surprised people are hating on it here. I am sure if someone pro XI went to XIV forums and said negative things about that game, it would have its defenders too. Altho I imagine they bash WoW over there more than anything.
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By RadialArcana 2021-11-28 06:05:23
I guess this is all I will say: I don't understand the intense hate for XIV.
My personal dislike for XIV (and I think many people are like this) is actually to do with a minority from the XIV community that go around attacking other mmorpgs, however these days that isn't happening here. XIV players don't really attack or care about XI much anymore, these days it's mainly about attacking WOW, NW or anything new since they see those as direct competition. To be perfectly frank, most XI players don't care about XIV at all either. They are just sick and tired of hearing about a game they have no interest in. If people kept bringing up wow here or ingame, they would get a far more aggressive reaction no doubt because it comes across as shilling.
Ultimately though, why does it matter. Nothing anyone says is hurting it, so it's just because it upsets you to hear bad things about it from anyone. If that is the case you're going to be trolled forever, since it's easy pickings for someone with a new troll account they registered a week ago.
One of the biggest problems with XIV is the players REALLY don't like anyone to say anything bad about it and get hyper defensive. Honestly, there is far more negativity posted here about XI from people playing it than towards XIV from people who don't.
By Afania 2021-11-28 06:51:03
Except XIV thumpers have been hating on and bashing XI since 1.0...
I guess this is all I will say: I don't understand the intense hate for XIV.
these days it's mainly about attacking WOW, NW or anything new since they see those as direct competition.
By Seun 2021-11-28 09:12:23
Ragnarok.Ghishlain
サーバ: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1081
By Ragnarok.Ghishlain 2021-11-28 09:15:19
When FFXIV was 1st announced we were told that FFXI and FFXIV would be inter connected. You could walk into your Mog in 11 and walk out into 14. You got a source for this? there is no way in hell this was ever planned.
XIV didn't kill XI. People got tired of playing it and moved on. Shocker, I know. But if it makes you feel better then keep blaming Yoshida and the XIV boogeyman.
It was definitely during Dev discussions. SE never used Taru & Mithras until FFXI. No other FF game had such Races. There is no reason for them to exist in FFXIV other than via Dev Discussions claiming 11 connecting to 14.
You’re talking Dev discussions from 10+ years ago now?
No, I don’t have links. I tried searching but cannot find what I know I was discussing amongst LS atm way back then.
It’s not a coincidence that Taru & Mithras exist in 14. I know why they do.
A quick google netted the following results:
Here's a little bit about the perks of subscribing to both games on the Playonline.. archive let's say? I imagine this page isn't accessible. Notably something specific about names:
And here's an article about a translation of what Hiromichi Tanaka and Nobuaki Kumoto said when they spoke to several publishing sites. Notable clip below regarding characters transferring between XI and XIV:
So, it seems like they were toying with the idea of having characters being able to travel to either game but could not implement it due to technical limitations. Based on what's written in the article, this is probably what you are remembering given it's a 12 year old article at this point. They also talk about the similarities in races to provide familiarity to XI players in there.
===========================================================
I rarely, if ever, see someone pro XI go to an XIV forum and bash their game, but it happens constantly here and this was suppose to be a positive thread for XI.
I don't see posters bashing XI here. I see more posters bashing XIV then poster bashing XI. The most that has happened are a few players who have played / are playing both XI and XIV trying to correct a misinformed view on the fight design of XIV but not have explicitly said "FFXI is garbage". In contrast, there have been posts like:
FFXIV is literally terrible compared to FFXI is the Problem.
Where as the few people who have defended XIV have also added a disclaimer to their post with "Different strokes for different folks" because these posters also recognize they are de-railing the overall topic of the thread too.
I personally like Skyekitty's analogy in this post about car vs motorcycles and find it apt to the overall dynamic between XI and XIV.
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By Mattelot 2021-11-28 09:19:36
Except XIV thumpers have been hating on and bashing XI since 1.0... I have been around the forums a long time and have seen that over and over lol. I rarely, if ever, see someone pro XI go to an XIV forum and bash their game, but it happens constantly here and this was suppose to be a positive thread for XI. The problem is, both really cant exist in a healthy state thanks to SE.
I have played all 3 MMOs extensively. You are right, pro XI players never go on their forums and bash the game. Whether that's because the population of XIV players greatly outweighs the population of XI players or because we know we have nothing to prove to anyone.
All I said was, dont be surprised people are hating on it here. I am sure if someone pro XI went to XIV forums and said negative things about that game, it would have its defenders too. Altho I imagine they bash WoW over there more than anything.
From what I've seen, all someone pro XI has to do is say "I did not enjoy XIV" and they're branded a hater/troll, etc. It's like the concept of not liking that game is taboo or something. I see the exact same reactions on the WoW forums from them as well.
To be fair, WoW players in general have their own issues too. The amount of blind shilling from them is quite staggering. The amount of blind faith they put in random people on the internet is staggering as well.
Ragnarok.Ghishlain said: »Different strokes for different folks
If I had a nickel for each time someone said this to XIV players and got a response like "No, there is no "different strokes", it's the goat", I could buy you a OLED Switch.
I've been on forums for all the games so much, I could know most all the pros/cons to each type of poster from each game. All have their faults.
By llAKs0nll 2021-11-28 09:53:23
Ragnarok.Ghishlain said: »When FFXIV was 1st announced we were told that FFXI and FFXIV would be inter connected. You could walk into your Mog in 11 and walk out into 14. You got a source for this? there is no way in hell this was ever planned.
XIV didn't kill XI. People got tired of playing it and moved on. Shocker, I know. But if it makes you feel better then keep blaming Yoshida and the XIV boogeyman.
It was definitely during Dev discussions. SE never used Taru & Mithras until FFXI. No other FF game had such Races. There is no reason for them to exist in FFXIV other than via Dev Discussions claiming 11 connecting to 14.
You’re talking Dev discussions from 10+ years ago now?
No, I don’t have links. I tried searching but cannot find what I know I was discussing amongst LS atm way back then.
It’s not a coincidence that Taru & Mithras exist in 14. I know why they do.
So, it seems like they were toying with the idea of having characters being able to travel to either game but could not implement it due to technical limitations. Based on what's written in the article, this is probably what you are remembering given it's a 12 year old article at this point. They also talk about the similarities in races to provide familiarity to XI players in there.
===========================================================
Thank you for finding such. I searched the Internet nonstop but could not find any trace to such info. Much appreciated.
Anyways I don’t have anything against FFXIV players enjoying FFXIV. I gave 14 ARR a shot myself but I much preferred 11. I don’t hate on anyone for playing that game nor do I wish for its demise. I only bash 14 cuz I played it to a point where it’s easy to compare 11 to 14.
By Mattelot 2021-11-28 09:59:31
Anyways I don’t have anything against FFXIV players enjoying FFXIV
Nobody should. It just seems there are people out there who are "offended" by what others enjoy. Joe Blow may be a very lazy gamer, so he enjoys one over the other. That's his business.
サーバ: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1360
By Odin.Creaucent 2021-11-28 10:04:35
I guess this is all I will say: I don't understand the intense hate for XIV. or the shitting all over someone else who enjoys it. I have played XIV for maybe 3 years, I'm not a vet or anything but in all my time spent playing I have never run into anyone ***talking XI. Its always positive things and good memories.
I never try to claim XIV is better than XI, or actively try to tear someone down for enjoying XI still but it seems like that's how most XI players act when it comes to players of XIV.
I love XI, I love the memories I gained from it but its not a game that I want to play anymore. I'm glad people are still playing and enjoying it. I want it to last as long as it can. I would love to see it get an influx of new players and new content to do. There is room for 2 FF mmos, they don't have to be the same game.
Idk, I ramble.. We all need less hate and more hugs.
I like both games I just stick up for a game I like when people who obviously haven't got very far try to bash it. I've played WoW and while yes both games have GCD systems they don't feel anything alike.
By Mattelot 2021-11-28 10:08:52
people who obviously haven't got very far try to bash it
I defended XIV on the WoW forums not long ago when some guy gave his "review" of the game, talking about how "terrible" it was after he played it for a whole 2 whopping days. Never even unlocked his first job stone or did anything relevant.
Things I think are good about FFXI, people tend to ask why are you still playing that game so I thought I would write some things down.
Basics: I like that I can play any job on one character, this instills a greater connection with your character and a greater feeling of community because people are always on that character, so you always see them on it. The gear swapping system is great for many different reasons, from the aspect of adding some complexity to play to just having so much gear to chase. I like the skillchain/MB system, that is still relevant today at near all levels of play. I like that the game has a massive wealth of different things to do and they are all deep enough to get involved in them, crafting, mog garden, pet rearing, monstrosity etc. It's so annoying to me when I find a game I really like and it's 90% just dungeon variation spamming.
1. No Cash shop (muh "optional" items), I know exactly how much I'm spending on FFXI and I can't spend anymore. The issue with playing an MMMORPG is that you spend large amounts of time in these games, and it's very easy to spend money on "optional items". You think you would not cause you're good with money, but you will and you can spend a lot. You get attached to your characters, you're feeling tired and mentally worn down after playing for 4-5 hours, it's 1am, you're bored and there is that fancy $30 mount you just saw someone run past you. Cash shops are predatory and the company manipulates you, you're not immune. On FFXI it's not "optional" at all, they don't have one.
1a. I like the subscription only model, not only for the reason above and because it creates a kind of unwritten contract where they make content regularly (I have another f2p game I enjoy but they very rarely add anything new at all, and it's infuriating because I do spend money on it) but also because paying a monthly sub encourages you to actually play the game. I have lots of f2p games installed that I can play any time I want to, I never play them because there is no mental imperative to do so.
2. I fit into the community in the game cause they are near all over 25+, I don't like playing games with a social foundation where I feel completely out of place. On games like Overwatch or whatever it doesn't matter, you're just shooting people but these games are community based. Not to say everyone on 11 acts like a civlized individual or anything but it's trolling, drama or jokes that gel with me and that I'm used to. Talking of which, you can actually tell jokes or be a troll/drama queen free from being banned for hurting somebodies feelings. The GMs ignore most reports about silly issues like this and just tell you to blist, cause the developers set these rules down long ago before current culture took over. Many modern MMORPGs are played by people who were brought up on social media, they think everything is toxic and many modern games are simply fake friendly because of fear of being banned.
2a) I like that due to the nature of the party building system, some of the most highly respected players of this game are the party builders. People who make groups and become admired for not only doing this but doing it well and being very knowledgeable. On modern games there would be no status in this, because it isn't needed.
2b) I like that the game still tries to force players to interact with others to a greater or lesser degree, there are still roadblocks like mission fights, gear unlocks or whatever where you have to reach out to others. Even new players can be totally lost in how to play and ask for help, and people can and do offer it. It's good that players are still the most important force in the game world, when you need help other players are there and not some UI button to insta match you with others. It actually does feel good to reach out for help and someone to send a tell and offer to help you with something you've been struggling with for hours or days, even if it's harder to get that help in the first place.
In my first year of playing I was on the verge of quitting, because I could not get my limit break 1 item in Eldieme. I played completely solo as a BST and so had nobody to ask for help, upto this point I could do everything alone so needed nobody. I struggled for 2 days and died over and over (I even had to go relevel and come back and keep trying), even if I did manage to down a Lich with my weak jug pets and reraise / dia the drop rate was so bad it seemed impossible. At the point of near just giving up a 75 BST checked me and sent me an invite, he spent an hour getting me my item and i remember feeling guilty he was wasting so much time on me. That simple action that really probably meant very little to him, changed my entire outlook on ffxi. I felt as if I was part of a community after that, the next day I carried on leveling WHM and would spend a lot of time helping other players (eventually on my main BST 75 too, wanting to do for others what he had done for me). I went from a complete solo player not caring about helping anyone to spending almost all of my time outside of a XP parties doing just that. Even today, FFXI still has this system in place for different things and most other games do not.
3. I like the way the auction house works, I like the economy where inflation and supply/demand are actually a thing and how everyone is interlinked more than on other games. I like that gil has real value for players and that to make gil you mostly have to get it from other players, farming items they want.
4. There is always something to do when you login. FFXI has so many long term goals and things to do that it's near impossible to have nothing to do when you login, on most modern mmorpgs you quickly run out of things to do becasue they are all aimed at casual players that complain about "grind" or "not respecting your time". As such they make the games now to appeal to non-mmorpgs players and I'm an mmorpg player.
5. I like that your server is your entire world and there is nothing outside of that. When I group up with some people, help some random person/get help or even just wandering around doing my own thing, I'll see the same names around all the time and I'll remember them from previous encounters. This promotes a heavy feeling of familiarity in your game world and world building, when I login and wander my home nation especially it feels good. It feels like "home" because I see the same people and have for years. When you play modern games you're mostly always playing with people off server, as such you're very aware you will never see this person ever again. So you have zero incentive to bother with them and they are instantly forgotten.
6. I like that the game does not tell you what to do at every moment, or that it's not completely linear (do this endgame, then this, then this in that order etc). Leveling is very open, endgame content has lots of routes to your goal (and those goals can be different).
7. I like that the game has long-term goals as standard. Whether it's getting +2 Ambuscade gear as a solo player, REMA or working on serious endgame gear with groups. Modern games are so afraid of people getting bored and quitting that everything is easy and short term. The problem with this is that gratification delayed is gratification magnified, so you will never get the immense feeling of gratification from anything on a modern mmorpg that you will get from achieving your goals on FFXI.
I remember none of the gear I obtained on most modern MMORPGS I've played, because it was easy to get and quickly replaced anyway. I remember every major piece of gear I've obtained on FFXI because I had to work hard to get them and there was emotion linked to that, from my Byakkos Haidate, Kirins Osode, getting my first Relic with the help of my linkshell, Dalmatica, my first Ambsucade +2 set after returning, completing malignance set etc.
8. I like that the game has more or less horizontal progression, there is always gear to go work for to improve but they don't wipe out your entire gear sets every 6-12 months. If you take a break for a year and come back, your gear is still good. Remember what they did with Abyssea with gear and how everyone was so mad? modern mmorpgs do that every major patch.
9. I like that they allow you to become really strong at endgame and that there is so much upgrade potential on your character (get to 99, get merits, get job points, get lots of gear etc), if you put a lot of work in it will show and you can become a beast. This is unlike most games where everyone is near enough the same and the cap is low to stop anyone feeling inferior. On FFXI the effort you put into your char/gear is significant and the game allows you to excel.
9a) I like that knowledge is important and you can't just overpower everything. For instance that Lillith can spike you to death and you need to turn, that a darkness skillchain heals her or how charm works etc. FFXI rewards hard work and knowledge, and that knowledge is figured out by the players and shared.
10. I like that FFXI does not have a single set of gear that you never take off, they have a macro system that lets you swap every piece of gear based on the situation or what you want to do. This means, you don't just work to get 6 pieces of BIS armor and a weapon and are done. You can get vast amounts of gear and swap between them. This builds into the "always something to do" system since there is so much gear to get.
11. I like the way the combat works, on most mmorpgs they have rotations of skills. So you're constantly pressing 1, 2, 3, 4 etc over and over forever. I hate this kind of busy work, because most of the time I'm doing casual stuff like farming or doing some daily activities while watching a movie. I feel like I'm wearing out my keys on most mmorpgs. Pressing 6 keys is no better than pressing 2 if the outcome is the same, it's just about fooling you into thinking you're doing something skilled when you're not. The combat also speeds up when it needs to (when you have buff jobs boosting you etc), and not always the same. Something else I'm really glad does not exist on XI is telegraphing, although this can be fun these games tend to overuse it and it becomes boring and very annoying. I don't want to endlessly move out of circles or red boxes while playing.
12. I like that the game has proper varied jobs that fill specific roles, for instance a healer is a proper healer and your job is -keep everyone alive- and that's it. There are pure buff jobs that exist just to buff the damage dealers, this is near unheard of in modern games. You can actually run out of MP if your gear is poor or you're playing poorly, the tank can lose aggro easily or a DD can miss a skill if you don't gear or play correctly. Modern mmorpgs make all jobs easy to play and very similar so no matter what job you're on, you're pretty much playing the same role and/or have to be really bad to fail to play it effectively.
13. I like that the jobs are allowed to be different and have strengths and weaknesses, I like that some jobs are far stronger than others for pure damage and that some jobs are situationally better than others. The jobs all actually feel really different and have different uses. Some jobs like BLU are incredibly fun and rewarding, you can change how the job plays or what spells it can use (blue can be pure DD, cure, crowd control, AOE murder etc) based on which spells you equip. Summoner on FFXI is fantastic, the avatars all look great and it's very powerful.
13a) I like that there is far more customization with your jobs on FFXI than on many other games, ultimately you do still end up fitting in with the meta but there is still a lot of customization possibility than you are allowed on other games. Subjobs, gear, weapon choices etc.
14. The endgame content is very unpredictable and can be very difficult (unless you're geared out the butt). I like that failing has consequences and doesn't just warp you back to the front of the boss to try again, when you have nothing to lose winning feels hollow. When I came back a few years ago, I struggled so hard with Zitah NMs. Beating my first one after failing many tries felt so good. To most others it's nothing, but to me it was a major victory and FFXI is full of things like this.
14a) I like how endgame isn't just directly linked to spamming different dungeons over and over, there are so many different things you can go do that have meaning. There is also far less stress put upon you to be doing specific things, when I play modern mmorpgs I very much do end up just spamming dungeons in group finder over and over all day. I very much do feel pressure to be doing that too.
15. I like that leveling isn't via stupid mini story quests that you never read anyway. I like that they just give you kill count quests and do away with the pretense that you care about "Fred Jones the hunter needs 10 rat tails or his house will be repossessed by captain crunch, can you help them brave adventurer?" "ok"
16. I like the crafting system, not only is it very difficult to cap out but it's very useful and linked to the economy. It also gives avenues of long progression if you choose to follow them. Sub-crafts, sheilds, knowledge of how to make profits etc
17. I like multiboxing, this is a niche enjoyment but I really like that I can not only multibox without having 4 computers but that the gameplay supports you doing it without automating everything, cause it does not have rotations etc. On other games I tend to make lots of alts and end up swapping between them for dailies, on FFXI I can have them all logged in at the same time and doing stuff. It does give an oldschool FF feel to me in some ways.
18. I like the customization via windower addons, the limitaitons of the UI was the mother of invention here and so we have all these things that a game with a more modern UI would never have.
19. I love the game world and how the developers encourage you to explore it and also to goto certain places to do content and not just let you warp into whatever form wherever (if you wanna do Amb you goto Mhuara, if you wanna do Ody you goto Rabao etc), I love how there is a nice mix or open/instanced/dungeon content, I love the deep lore where you can find things out years later that you never knew while doing the missions, I love the stories (even if many are bittersweet), I love the respect the developers have for the game world. Vana'diel feels like a real place to me in many ways, and this is not only for the things above but also because of the community aspects I mentioned earlier in the post too.
20. I personally like that near everything can be modded on FFXI, it's almost like a mini Skyrim in many ways. Not only from the perspective of making your own mods but using others mods.
21. I like how the game scales to the players and there are different paths, one person can be working on Ambu +2 gear as their long-term endgame goals when they login every day and another can be grinding out Gaol gear/upgrades. Everyone isn't just doing the same thing, and you can be a more casual player with less elite goals and be fine with that.
22. I like the music style, I like the overall aesthetic, character and monster designs. It's not stylized in a way that alienates people, it's not overly flashy and gaudy. A huge turnoff for me with 14 is the anime music style, art style, overly gaudy flashy OTT effects etc
23. I like that the game will not be replacing pictures of mithra with bowls of fruit or pandering to modern day SJW issues, the developers just want to make content and not push an agenda.
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