High End Sets Advice/Suggestions/Ideas/LUA

Can you post them? I am still trying to figure out how I want to set up my idle stuff

Thanks for that!

What would you need on Ody pants to beat AF legs for TP set? I know the Enmity+ sux, but I usually pull aggro anyway and if anything I could use them for a tanking set.

Generally, the augment to aim for with Ody legs is STP, preferably +8. As with most things in this game, it depends when it would beat other gear choices. In this case, it depends on what you need for the specific x-hit build you are aiming for. The sets on the first page show you what STP to aim for.

Edit: the pair I use have +7stp, but that is enough, with all the other STP I have in the set, to get to my x-hit.

Thanks Gesetz. I have a pair with 36 ACC/30ATK 9STR and 4% DA I'm using till I finish getting AF legs to +3. Was hoping I would still have a use for them after that. Appreciate the help.

More than likely not its hard to beat out the pants once +3 like people said before you'd have to get 8stp and even then change up gear to fit it.

sets["DRK_DT_GS"] = {
main="Caladbolg",
sub="Utu Grip",
ammo="Ginsen",
head="Sulevia's Mask +2",
neck="Loricate Torque +1",
ear1="Brutal Earring",
ear2="Cessance Earring",
body="Valorous Mail",
hands="Sulev. Gauntlets +2",
ring1="Moonlight Ring",
ring2="Defending Ring",
back="Ankou's Mantle",
waist="Sailfi Belt +1",
legs="Sulev. Cuisses +2",
feet="Flam. Gambieras +2"

Is this still considered the best DT set or is it not updated with the Odin set?

Hi Valkyy, I have a feeling we've met before...

As to your question the set you listed works fine as a general DT set, but the question of what is the "best" DT set gets really murky these days, because high end DT sets can be taken in so many different directions.

HP stacking hybrid DT sets make more sense for Apocalypse builds where you expect to have over 4k HP in your Catastrophe set, but get more awkward for other weapons, and only get worse when you factor max HP changes in precast and midcast for spells. In general though focusing on HP stacking is less valuable due to Drain3, but plenty of folks do it anyway. I'm not a fan because it can take some serious fine tuning to make high HP DT sets viable through WS and spell casting. Trying to wring maximum HP through precast and midcast is bad enough on Paladin as it is, I don't need that headache on Drk. This sort of gear approach works better for WARs who mostly have to worry about maintaining HP through WS, not DRKs.

That said, filling out DD stats after capping DT makes the most sense to me, and seems to be mostly what you're going for.
Odin head and body are great. Sulevia's hands +2 are still hard to beat. Volte legs from Dynamis Windurst D are fantastic and come with 9% haste. Other Volte gear is nice, but not as critical unless you are going for a magic evasion build. Pay more attention to gear haste when working with Odin gear, as it doesn't have any.

Your gear looks good for the most part, and I'd ask what do you want to specialize in or build around rather than a blanket "What's best?" question. If you like DT sets that pack in as much damage output as possible, you're already on the right track, and its just a matter of swapping in pieces that are better than what you have.

You have more options though.
People who like HP stacking often like to mix in a piece of Ratri+1 gear, and just stack more DT to compensate.

Regal Captain's Gloves from Ou can enable a weird tanky build all their own. They are a really niche piece that often go unclaimed off Ou. The lower your accuracy the more multiattack they give you, which is pretty pointless when you are rocking DD gear. Priorities change when you have to turtle up. Regal Captains Gloves are great because you can focus heavily or even entirely on defensive gear, and use the gloves as a guaranteed minimum TP income.

So yeah, plenty of options its just a question of "What do you want your DT set to be?"

hp moving around a lot also drives healbots nuts, as ppl i know whine about a lot.

ammo="Staunch Tathlum +1",
head="Hjarrandi helm",
neck="Loricate Torque +1",
ear1="Genmei Earring",
ear2="Odnowa Earring +1",
body="Hjarrandi Breast.",
hands="Sulev. Gauntlets +2",
ring1="Moonlight Ring",
ring2="Defending Ring",
back="Moonlight Cape",
waist="Ioskeha belt +1",
legs="Ig. Flanchard +3",
feet="Flamma gambieras +2"

This is what i'm using atm for PDT set but seen the front page and wondered if mine was wrong.

Nothing in there is blatantly obviously wrong, but just listing gear doesn't tell us anything about why you are using what you are using.

I can say without hesitation that blindly copying what is on the front page of this thread is a bad idea. That page is often either not updated for a while, or someone sees a shiny new piece of gear and decides to put it in a place it doesn't belong. Yes, I'm looking at you whoever last updated the Insurgency set.

In any case, that looks like a hybrid DT and DD set with a fair amount of HP splashed in, but there is plenty I don't know.

Does it maintain accuracy parity with your TP and WS sets?
Does the HP stacking actually matter? Do you for instance want a dedicated Apoc DT set with +HP and a more general DT set where you swap in more DD gear?
Are you capping haste with LR down? Is that something that matters to you?

The gear you have is not in any way bad, but posting a set without clear context about what you want to use it for makes it hard to answer your question.

Hp bots are lame anyway. Just make /send macros.

Yeah between work and whatnot I dont update them as often as I should, but they are normally close to updated. Feel free to make suggestions and I can try updating them if I am missing something.

Thanks Azgarth!
Lugra Earring +1 and Sailfi Belt +1 are good pieces for WS that aren't Insurgency.

As a general rule for Insurgency gear priority is
WSD > Accuracy > QA > DEX > TA >>>> STR = DA >= INT
with honorable mentions to TP Bonus, PDL, and Fotia's Bonus which proves just so hard to get rid of.

I know that's a pretty convoluted and weird sequence, but Insurgency under mythic AM3 is a strange beast, so please bear with me.

First off, WSD is pretty clearly the best way to scale Insurgency's initial hit. Simply slapping a TP bonus Moonshade on is enough for the initial hit to be large enough that WSD scaling is more potent than multiattack scaling, even at low TP values.

Second, this is not a single hit WS. The three additional hits, mythic procs, and multiattack procs add a significant portion of damage. While you can drop 100 accuracy in a Torcleaver set for instance, that is not an option for Insurgency. WS set Accuracy must equal TP set accuracy. And Drk TP sets have been getting more accurate, where in general Insurgency sets haven't seen as many obvious gear upgrades in recent times.

Getting to Multiattack:
Multiattack and AM3 don't get along well, which most everyone knows. Most people however don't have a clear idea on the numbers for how they interact, so here are some very rough numbers:

In general, for an AM3 TP set with a 2handed weapon like Liberator:
Quadruple Attack is worth about 75% of it's listed multiattack value.
Triple Attack is worth roughly 60% of it's listed multiattack value.
Double Attack is worth at most 20% of it's listed multiattack value.

The proportions get murkier for Insurgency. First off TP Scaling means the value of multiattack is greatest at low TP and least at maximum TP. Secondly there are two slots in which multiattack can proc. In the first slot AM3 can proc, in the second it cannot. Assume the value of Multiattack will be less favorable than it is in a TP set.

Finally, stat mods. 20% STR, 20% INT, 10% DEX from Utu Grip.
These mods are sad.
I listed DEX as more important earlier, because it does double duty in extending accuracy and buffing Utu Grip's modifier. Also note that I listed DEX as less important than raw accuracy. Thats right, at 75% accuracy conversion and 50% the the stat mod value, Dex is still better than STR or INT. Not because DEX is amazing, but because STR and INT are just that bad.

All that said, back to Sailfi +1 and Lugra Earring +1!
As a general rule, slots that do not have WSD need to be enabling slots that do.
Lugra Earring +1 is a great earring to be sure, but Thrud Earring exists. Moonshade / Thrud Earring is the earring combo to aim for, with Ishvara / Thud at 3k TP.

The belt slot is the weakest slot for current Insurgency options. That said, rather than trying to stack damage mods, the belt slot is probably best used as an accuracy slot to enable more WSD in other slots. The ideal case is that accuracy on the belt slot opens up Regal Ring's slot for Karieyh Ring +1.

That said, Ioskeha +1 is probably the best suited for that role, honorable mention to Olseni belt. Fotia probably still reigns as the best middle accuracy tier belt, and as far as low accuracy belts go I'm willing to bet Windbuffet +1 is going to be better than even a fully augmented Sailfi +1, but even then I'm not sure they are going to beat Fotia.

Why does Fotia Belt refuse to die?
Because it raises the value of WSD at low TP values in a way similar and complimentary to Moonshade Earring. Fotia's bonus is similar to multiattack in that it raises the minimum value of Insurgency's damage and decreases in value significantly at high TP values. The big difference is just that Fotia achieves this in a way that's a bit cleaner in relation to AM3.

That was a whole lot more words than I had initially intended to write, but there you go.

/edit
Minor corrections for clarity and grammar, added "Why does Fotia refuse to die?" section

Thanks for the input I know Fotia is best for Insurgency and I am not sure why I had changed it, The earring though I did notrealize would be so impactful as I think I have used Insurgency 2x? in past 5 yrs haha. Having said this now, would Thrud not be eclipsed by the 48(24) mod stats that Lugra would offer? Even with poor modifier that seems pretty big deal for one slott, the DA is just icing. Maybe this only applied to non lib users?

Nothing in the guide is assuming the person owns a lib other than the insurgency set - so it is nice to have updated for sure. If you would like to give me the perfect tp set I will add another tp set to the guide as I know there has been a few request for this. I just never have done it since I know the majority of Drks do not own a lib and probably wont.

10 STR 3% WSD vs 8 8Dex 8STR 8 INT and 3% DA, that sometimes has more stats makes for stiff competition, I will admit.
I'm the sort of person who tends to write off the extra Dusk to Dawn stats on the grounds that they aren't up all the time, but they aren't nothing.
Lugra +1 is probably favorable if you are using Insurgency without Liberator or AM3, but if thats the case you're probably doing an SC where your WS damage is not the primary focus.

I just did some napkin math, which got more complicated pretty quick the deeper I went.

Short answer is that Thrud earring was a net gain of 1.14% to 1.78% damage over wearing no earring, from 1250 to 3k TP.
Lugra (Daytime) was a .967% to .860% gain over no earring, from 1250 to 3k TP
Lugra (Nighttime) was a 1.76% to 1.65% gain over no earring, from 1250 to 3k TP

I had planned on having numbers that were easier to see, but this got too messy too fast.
These assume that the accuracy from Dex on Lugra +1 is irrelevant. If Accuracy isn't capped, or if AM3 is not up, Lugra +1 will win.

/edit Missed the 8% WSD JP Gift, updated. I'm not 100% confident with these numbers, but they look reasonable enough.

The short answer is that there isn't one.
Believe me, people have been pestering me as well to post the "perfect" Liberator AM3 set, and I've been actively avoiding answering for a long time. Every good AM3 set uses at least one Oseem piece, I personally use 3.
I think Odyssean Cuisses and Valorous Greaves are the best pieces to aim for a Store TP augment on, but a good Vbody can be competetive too. Things get even harder to pin down if you have a QA3 DM augment that you want to work in.

It really is a matter of finding the best individual pieces you personally have and building around them.

You want an AM3 set? Start here and build one:
ItemSet 373800
You need 68-74 store TP in gear, and are going to want to be able to cap haste with LR down.
Why are there so many blank spots?
Because you have to fill them in your goddamn selves, people.
volte harness is good and has 4% haste, Hjarrandi breastplate is good and has 0%.
Both Flamma +2 and Emicho +1 hands are acceptable.
Odyssean Cuisses are great even without DM augments. Fern stones can land up to 8 Store TP, but a lower amount with a decent store TP roll can be as good, if not better.
Flamma +2 feet are good, Valorous Feet can potentially be better. See the Odyssean legs guidelines.

What belt to use? Ioskeha +1 Sailfi +1 and Tempus Fugit are all good. Hell, if it completes someone's build I wouldn't even be mad if they used a goddamn goading belt.

If you need a Dedition earring, use it. If you can fit an Balder earring +1, great. If you have to use a Dignitaries earring for the acc, thats fine too.

THERE IS NO PERFECT AM3 SET.
GET IT THROUGH YOUR HEADS.
I WILL NOT DO YOUR HOMEWORK FOR YOU.

mims your rant made me happy on the inside. thanks! :D

I'm glad you could see some humor in this, but I hope you can understand how frustrating this stuff can be.

I've been playing Dark Knight since pre-ToAU days, and I've always cared about being the best player I can be. I feel a sort of kinship with others who, like me, want to be the best players they can be. We don't always agree, and that's fine. Ideally that sort of disagreement gets us to get off our butts and find out what really is best.

That said, people have come to me for advice in this game for a long time, and definitely not just in this forum. I want to help these people! I want to help them know what stats and numbers mean, and how to relate them to actually playing well in FFXI. I want people to be able to make their own decisions about what piece of gear to use when, how to build their own gear sets. I want people to know not just "What piece is good" but "Why is that piece good." This is a game where knowledge of what piece of gear to put where directly impacts your performance as a player. Following guides is good in so far as you learn why to do what they tell you to do.

If you are blindly following a cookie cutter build, you are bad and you should feel bad.

I guess I'm especially frustrated, because of a couple of recent incidents. There is a relatively frequent stream of "I don't care about why, just tell me what piece to use!" people, and a particularly bad incident recently where a guy wanted help with a Lua file.
I'm fine with helping people as long as it pertains to helping people learn to do things themselves. I have no desire to do peoples work for them. This person asked for help with a lua file, and by "help" it turned into "do everything for me." That is not why I am here. Do your own work.

If you want me to make your sets, make your Luas, and spoonfeed you so that you can parse well without having to ever bother with the question of why you are doing what you are doing, you are asking me to do a job. As in work. As in if you want me to do this, you are going to have to literally pay me. And considering that I don't really want to do it, you are probably going to have to pay me a lot.

Just do your own homework, please.

It can be frustrating, because those of us who have played this game for a decade+ mostly have figured out that a single ideal build for a job just doesn't exist. Yes, there are always gonna be some similarity between people, but its not a recipe you go shopping for. Its granny's old recipe that was never really written down, so Auntie Sue does it one way, and your mom does it another, and neither is really Granny's recipe. But because everyone learned how to cook, not copy, they all taste great.

That's what works best- learn how to cook. Learn the why behind a set and its build vs just the what. Or, if you prefer a more biblical comparison- learn how to fish, don't be given a fish.

I swear, this is my life

The best AM3 set for Lib is just Caladbolg :). But like mims said people gotta use builds as a base line not end all be all. You really wanna be careful on which people you get info from also lot of people using wrong math on spreadsheets so they think something is better when its not. Kinda like how wars still think GA beats out fencer build lol. Test what works for you and what augments you got and go from that.

Mims and others I would just like to reference the very first post I made almost 3 yrs ago, it still holds true today, please read again as I think your way off base for the page of aggresive complaining on a internet forum that is voluntary to participate on:


If after reading that your still confused let me make it very clear by pulling a few parts out so you understanding what your doing is wrong for this intended thread;

Thank you Azgarth, I appreciate what you have been doing, both in this thread and in general.
I want to state that my rant earlier was not in response to you, or even anyone in particular in this thread. I know it really seems like it is, and I'm sorry about that.

I get /tells in game, messages on FFXIAH, DMs on Discord, messages on Guildwork, and more. Most people are great, which really does make me happy. Not everyone is a good experience though.

So yeah, I got mad and I ranted, and I want to be clear that this has been a rant that has been a long time coming, and honestly isn't even a reflection on the people or the questions of this thread, but on people asking for advice in general.

So yeah, I hope you can understand.
And I did make a starter AM3 TP set a while back, which I can update with high-end, non Oseem gear.

So yeah, Azagarth, sorry for ranting in your thread.
To the people who have been asking me thoughtful questions, keep doing it! You are great!
To the people who don't want to do their own work, I'm not going to spoonfeed you.

You contribute a lot Mims, I understand as I have these questions you are getting going on for many years. It can be stressful but lets not make this thread that way. If it is truly an endgame level query from someone, direct them here to publically ask and get some constructive talk going. This thread is semi dead so some new life would be nice with new faces.

My general rule of thumb for this thread (since its literally called high end) is that you can assume non-dm augs to be at max value of desired special stat (5/4wsd, 5da, 8stp, etc) and 70% of the rest (like 7 Str/vit 20acc for a ws piece, or 7 dex 20 acc or the equivelent acc for a tp item). This is easily obtainable even if it is a headache, its just a question of how much time you want to spend at oseem.

I would be shocked for example if someone spent more than 5k stones to get 15 vit 4 wsd plus some acc on ws parts, same goes for 8 stp high acc on tp items. I can say this because I have done it multiple times and even though its random, you do eventually even with randomness hit some normality.

for example this is the set id use when AM is up, but seeing that I have nor will I ever own a Lib I cannot say its the best; assume all augs 8 stp

ItemSet 373796

I use something very similar to this, but I use moonlight ring instead of hentai ring, telos earring instead of balder earring, and hjarrandi breastplate instead of valorous mail. I like the extra DT; if you're Insurgency spamming with a good set you're going to be tanking, and sometimes you won't have capped HP.

This is the absorb set mentioned on the first page.

ItemSet 349381

Wouldn't the latest BiS set have Liberator, Khonsu and Ullr instead? (I'm assuming it's OK to lose TP if I want the most potent Absorb possible, with the best chance of landing).

ItemSet 373817

Thoughts?

Mani Earring?