Continued Prime Weapon NA Review

Your words, not mine. I can get a Su5 weapon without buying one, or the mats to buy one, off the AH.


Maybe it's just a difference in personality or whatever, but I put a lot less emphasis on the gil items people have and a lot more on the r/e stuff they farmed. I'd be much more impressed with someone who had 20 mythics and 8 crafting shields than someone who had 3 copies of every Su5 weapon, and a full set of every HQ Su3 armor. Because one means they put forth a ton of effort (guaranteed) and the other just means they're obscenely rich. Maybe they got really lucky with Osash from AMAN trove, maybe they bought a few billion gil off brogame, maybe their friend quit and left them 12b gil. Either way, gil is transient and having a lot of it proves nothing. That's just like, my opinion man.


Do you like having people to play the game with? Having content which people are working on encourages them to keep playing, so you can play with them. Imagine a new player returns 4 months from now and is looking for people to do Sortie with, since he's never done it before. In a world where everyone finished their Prime weapons in a month, who the hell is going to go with him? The goal of any MMO is to provide something for people to do with their spare time, and enough content for them to continue doing so. Making content which can be finished in a week by a dedicated player/team is counter to this goal.

Obviously this can be taken too far and you can end up with 10 year grinds or whatever, and it's a spectrum and completely subjective what's enough or too much of a grind, but making content last is like...their whole job.


I don't have any issue with ***-for-tat, I don't understand why people get their panties in a bunch about this (not you specifically, but people in general). This is a forum...meant for discussion amongst players and sharing of opinions. Going back-and-forth and having a debate is like...the whole point? IDK...maybe people get in their feelings about it but I don't.

To your point yes, I value a time investment over a gil investment very much, for the reasons I listed above, any jackass with a credit card, some luck, rich friends, or who's been playing long enough can have billions of gil.

They're dragging it out because it's the end. With no new content other than a master trial on the way, it makes sense that they design the last content added to the game as long-term. I'm curious why people thought they were joking when they stressed that this content would take a long time.

You should be synthing your own spheres, not swiping your credit card.

Hilarious. Even if you are gifted 100% of the spheres for an escutcheon, it's still 100x the work of any other item in this game. It takes a million+ GP, countless thousands of synths for craftsmanship, a ton of work collecting and synthing mats for customer requests and roes, leveling all the subcrafts, farming crystals, plus spending a week straight doing synthchains after you have the spheres. Of course, I also didn't buy any of the gil for any of my shields, I earned every bit of it, so it's beside the point, but even if someone bought a billion gil and didn't earn a single sphere, I'd still be impressed by their gumption for finishing a shield. Especially so if they did it without automating all the synths and synthchains.

Slightly more effort than getting an osash from gobbie box and buying a Rostam, but who am I to judge?

I don't know of a single group who's serious about maximizing their muffins that's going to bring a new/returning player to Sortie. There's 0 incentive to do so.

Also, you didn't answer my question about needing a shield for crafting a Rostam (I'm not a crafter, but I assume you need one).

I'm not against the debate at all either, just didn't want to come off as *** or anything.

I get what you're saying, which is typically why my AFK town gear is more rare/ex and less AH. Someone sitting around town with R30 Nyame SHOULD garner more ooooos and ahhhhs than someone showing off a k club.

I think our main difference is, at the end of the day I don't really care how someone got their weapon so much as I care how effectively they're using it, especially if they're in my party doing content with me. Gil doesn't buy skill/ability.

You're absolutely right, and that's what I meant by SE being the "winner".

Most people on these forums have probably been playing 10, 15, 20 years, a 6-month grind isn't scaring anybody away. We were all going to be here and still playing 6 months from now anyway. Was just hoping to have fun while doing so ; ;

Honestly just add 150k-250k muffins to ambuscade hallmarks/gallantry rewards and call it a day. Enough to help make the grind less awful but not so much that it easily completely bypasses having to do Sortie at all plus you'd still need to do sortie enough to get your -drites.

This sentence bothers me more than it has any right to. Why is it SE's responsibility to incentivize everyone to help each other? I get that it's nice when they do because it directly causes community to form, but like...you know you can just help people without a reward, right? Or like, make friends with returning players and then try to help them out because they're your friends?


Sorry, I didn't realize this was a question, I thought you were being rhetorical. Yes, you do need a shield to do the synthesis, not even just to make it economically viable, but to even attempt it. In this case if you're talking about the effort required to make a Su5 weapon yourself yes, it is the hardest item in the game to acquire by yourself.


I agree, and I feel like they do...people will check someone and be impressed by a kclub, but at the end of the day that guy could've just gotten lucky off a level 60 BCNM. When you see a guy with R30 nyame you know he's seen some ***. I feel the same way about Escutcheons, other highly-ranked ody gear, etc. and I doubt many players walk by someone with a Gandring and are like "damn, that guy must be good" or "damn, that guy worked HARD for that thing." IDK, maybe newer players see the Su5 and are really impressed because they've never had 10m before, but I think for most experienced players the r/e stuff is where it's at.


This isn't a difference, I agree with this 100%. I don't go around interrogating people about whether they farmed their own Bukhis Wings and judge whether they're good at ffxi based on that. However, I also give a lot more respect to someone who's finished a mythic than someone who's got a Su5 weapon and a +2 neck. It says nothing of their ability to play the game either way, anyone can grind this stuff out, but it's more of an accomplishment.

Mythics, Escutcheons, Empyreans (on Carbuncle), Aeonics, Relics (somewhat), ranked Ody gear, hell even Empy+3, prove you've done all the required content to get them. Su5 weapons, Su3 HQ gear, +2 necks, osash, epa ring, and all that other AH stuff proves absolutely nothing. You could have a level 1 character without a single home point unlocked and have all that stuff.

Anyway...I promise this is still on topic because! Prime weapons will be proof that the person at least participated in 125~200 Sortie runs, and I will respect that similarly to and honestly greater than the REMA, because you can't cheese it, you have to earn the whole damn thing.

Stage 4 Prime Weapon Requirements:

oof


I'd expect a minimum 5,000,000 + 15 psyche for stage 5



looking forward to any info on the WSs, and grats mischief+crew

Because they are the ones who put the 20-hour restriction on the entry item. They're the ones that created content that all but requires high end gear, REMAs, and tight party comps to efficiently grind it out. This isn't casual content. I'm surprised that you're surprised that altruism takes a back seat to efficiency here.


I do know this, and I do help people with nothing in return all the time. Sortie just isn't going to be one of those things.

The rest sounds like we're pretty much in violent agreement. R30 T3/Nyame is probably the most impressive accomplishment in the game right now. Anyone can invest in a time sink like Sortie, but not everyone is going to have that sweet, sweet R30. Very few in fact.

That is so much Sortie. And didn't Fujito say that stage 5 is extra painful?

Mischief tried Ra'Kaznar and Vagary to see if the WS would unlock in those areas, but no luck. We'll try it out in Sortie tomorrow and see what happens.

Well, but that was kinda the original point people were making in the beginning, and that you gave me the feeling you were arguing against? I apologize if I'm wrong.

There are several differences but the main one is that all other weapon types offer various "options", real choices, cathering to one's plersonal playstyles, time, feelings, tastes, whatever you wanna call it.
Prime Weapons, at the moment at least, aren't offering any option and it seems like very poor game design to overmilk a cow.
I'm now entirely against cow milking, especially given the sad but realistic situation of their dev team.
I'm just saying they could've found much better ways to do it, much better ways to give us a more satisfying carrot on a stick.


Anyway, as I mentioned multiple times I think it's way too early to let a final judgement fall on these weapons.
Let's try to take a different angle at this:

Relics, Mythics, Empy, Ergon:
They all required multiple grind of different intensity and also had some buyable/sellable stuff to some degree.
They got much easier over time thanks to new levels, game system adjustments, specific events adjustments, special KIs (RoV etc) and one of the biggest differences I feel has been letting stuff become available from other sources (Ambuscade).
Ergon in particular had a really tough 6months wall at start, but that happened only once and realistically the majority of real player didn't really had to start from zero but already had some variable level of completition of that 6 months requirement.

Aeonics:
I'd say impossible to solo, unless you have an army of mules maybe, but it was mercable and it became easier over time thanks to campaigns, power creep (Job Points, ML recently), jobs adjustments and mostly much better gear becoming available. The turning point was when people developed the SMN burn strat I'd say.


Prime Weapons:
It looks like this is actually more than 6 months grind. 6 months at least for the Psychesk and slightly more than that because of the Gallmaufry requirement.
This *might* become more feasible in the future for the following reasons:
1) There might be secret stuff we don't know that improve the Galli drop rate (for instance using a Prime)
2) They might add 2x Galli campaigns
3) Adjustments to various aspects of the event, like giving a galli tradeback to the various pretty useless items that drop in there
4) Allow alliances to enter Sortie
5) Other stuff I didn't mention

From this perspective if you try to see things in a mid/long run... it's not too bad?
But it implies that there's stuff we don't know yet and/or that some changes will eventually come.
Pretty plausible to happen, but not guaranteed I guess.

Aaaaaall right.
Adjusting the thing me and other players posted then


Stage 4 Prime Materials:
2.000.000 2,5m Gallimaufry
3 Hexahedrite
10 Voracious Psyche

Stage 5 Prime Materials:
3.000.000 at least 5m Gallimaufry
4 Mesosidrite
15 Voracious Psyche


It's quite irking how completely pointless the -drites are atm.
But I could say the Psyche too.
Either they are completely stupid (and it could be, but I doubt) or they have other plans to give a secondary purpose to -drites (and maybe Sapphires and Starstones too) and somehow increase the Gallimaufry average.

Stupid example:
Add a system where you can trade -drites for a small amount of Galli.
Increase the Galli under certain conditions and/or campaigns.

This would be perceived as "good" because it would make a process perceived as "super slow" somewhat faster, and usually this has a positive feedback from the community, but at the same time it would ensure there's at least 6 months grind to get one weapon, thanks to the Voracious Psyche requirement.
Now... if we're talking about something like this, I could see it as a somewhat acceptable if not even nice long-term game design on their end.

Afaik Mischief took staff, so we won't know much about other weapons judging by staff WS (different aftermath and it might scale differently too), but I'm looking forward to see if maybe stage 3 will alter drops somehow or proc bosses to drop more Galli. Also looking to more people from that group to finish more. You guys will sacrifice one run to check melee WSs?

What weapon did you even make, Mischief & gang?

I think it's gonna be 6.5m for total of 10M or simply 10M because it's such a nice rounded number :)

It's gonna be 6250k!!one!1one!
No but seriously, no way it's gonna be less than 5m, I think 6,5 is quite likley.

It should be 10M minimum since that's how the relic weapons upgrade scaled : 400 -> 1400 -> 6100

The Ergon weapons also have a similar scale, 500 -> 2500 -> 9999.

So 1m -> 2.5m -> 10m

But if it's 13.5 then how they assumed someone will finish this year, when best group at the time of the article were doing maybe 50k. Mischief would need to do 70k per run for another 180days to get another 12.5M Galli. Well maybe slightly less if you add 7 extra runs from Ruspix plate.

UNLESS they actually think dedicated group will make it every 20h, even if that means doing it in middle of the night or at dawn etc. Then you could technically make 216 runs in 180 days and then you would "only" need to get 57k Galli on avg.

But if he really assumed that, then it's some Tanaka lvl mentality.

I wondered the same.
But we don't know what they have in store.
If in a month or two they're gonna add a tradeback for items, things could speed up.
Or if you somewhat get more gally by killing/touching bosses with a Prime weapon equipped... which I seriously doubt it's ever gonna be a thing, but who knows?

The thing is, the more they wait to add some tradeback system for items, the more it will become difficult to add it because they didn't mention anything about it so far and people that dropped earrings, stones and -drites because they had no use for it would be right to complain about it.

It would also kinda bypass the 100k galli limit they had on for several months, because if you got like... let's say 2 stacks of earrings ready to trade, that would grant you an immediate amount of galli that were "farmed" before they raised the cap.

Or they would have to change the items somehow to differentiate between old and new and so on.

Stage 4 could be possible for July. There are still 5 months left in the year at that point to make stage 5. That's a lot of time to grind out a lot more galli.

Congrats Mischief and company! Stay safe.



I actually had a stack of old cases for May in case. The only thing I would think you'd have a turn in for is the upgrade stones since the stages require so few of them. You just make the early stages worth very little and the later stages be worth more do avoid the idea of excessive banked galli from before they raised the cap. That way you get the drama of leaving a stage 4 un-upgraded because it leaves the door open to farm higher value stones for your next Prime Weapons.

There will be tough if the last stage is 10M

Afaik Mischief's group basically does cycle of 2 runs
1. All bosses beside MB + roaming NMs
2. MB+6 bosses

avg per run is ~65k
Assuming once per day + Ruspix. There is maybe around 189 runs left this year, assuming they wont miss a single day. That's 12.285M Gali. They would need to increase Galli per run to like 70k or start going every 20h instead of every 24h to make it this year if last stage is 10M.

Boys, I think I'm done doing Sortie.

Going back to Casual ear farming. I’ll be cheering hard for Mischief and others!!

my feedback:

What is the routing that allows for this? While we have accomplished the all boss run once, it was without roaming NMs and seems hard to press for.

Maybe we are routing wrong? We do C > G > B > A (proc B & A at same time) > F > E > D/H

I'll be stopping at stage 4 since you get most of the benefits by then.