Kenkonken Parse

There's at least 11 registered at 75 on this site. The last census I remember saying something like 20+ on all servers.

Setting that aside, while I support the want for parses the best targets would honestly be higher tier nms simply because they are the harder targets and are more favored in general. While normal mobs would be easier to test on they wouldn't give an adequate show of what KKK could do in a high buff, strong target scenario. That's just my opinion though. At the very least, especially using the turtles, I suppose you could show some average Stringing Pummel numbers to show people what the ws is capable of with KKK though.

I am a PUP defender in my LS, i love the job, and have geared it accordingly for Smite and Pummel. my Verethragnas are level 90, as i don't have the gil to take it to 99, nor do i have the inclination to make a Kenkonken, when my plan is to make a Ryunohige.

I've seen a regular 2300-2600 Pummels in Salvage 2, and 18-2400 smites. Both sets are well geared. I've done Salvage with jonadriel and he can attest to my mastery of puppet. I don't think i'm quite as good as him at it, and i'm still missing some key components.

There is also a ton of pet/automaton Haste+ gear for the master, which stacks with the wind maneuvers.

Would i ever take my puppet into something like Legion? Only if i had KKK and Shijin Spiral maxed. As good as puppetmaster is, it is considered a versatile melee support job. It has the potential to deal great amounts of damage in conjunction with your automaton through Master WS, and Puppet WS, as well as the resulting Skillchain of either Light (VS > Armor Shatterer) or Darkness (Stringing Pummel > String Shredder).

The heaviest of the heavy damage dealers are Warrior, Dark Knight, Samurai, Monk, and Dragoon (although this one is fairly negiligible due to the fact most endgame mobs heavily resist piercing)

The problem with taking a puppetmaster into these major events is that the automaton dies quickly, and if it dies immediately after Deus Ex Automaton is used, you still have to wait the remainder of the 1 minute recast to resummon, essentially nullifying any potential output from your auto.

You could argue the use of Repair and all two of the repair enhancers (Guignol Earring and Puppetry Churidars), which again detracts from the Master output as well, and again, has a 2 minute recast. While the 2 minute recast doesn't seem all the long, it's more than long enough in the event of something like Legion.

The biggest difference between the DD i mentioned earlier, and pup, is the number of times they use their JA. Pup uses them constantly, while the others need only use at the beginning of battle between waves of mobs.

I support what you're saying. But I'm saddened by your forgetting of Desulator Tassets and Puppetry Churidars don't enhance Repair. :< If you meant Babouches, I apologize for being nit-picky. XP But still can you call that an enhancement given you're talking more about the healing effect of Repair which the Babouches do not enhance.

I still don't know why parses are still being asked for... they mean *** all... other than to see whos pimp at what they do and who is gimp.

The spreadsheets that people hate do not lie.. (well user error then they lie)

With the planned adjustments now coming up it could make and it SHOULD make PUPs KKK perform better I believe then is the time to remath it out and see its potential.

hmmmm re-reading the OP, I am thinking he just wanted to compare non-mythic PUP dmg against mythic PUP dmg and how much performance PUP get's out of the mythic. So, maybe the best way to answer his question is making a parser of a non-mythic PUP against a mythic PUP?
Or maybe he just wants to know how a mythic PUP puts out numbers compared to the top DD jobs, in wich case, any mob work if is to compare dmg, including the 100+ turtles.

The Babouches, yes. Anyways, the repair effect enhancement on those extends to the regen effect, and in order to fully utilize it, requries leaving them on during the duration of the regen.

And it's the Desultor Tassets.

I haven't forgotten about them, i simply chose to leave it out, as they are a somewhat negligible piece of leg equipment for the puprose of this thread.

I believe he meant the latter given this post from him further down the first page.
I hope I'm not misunderstanding your post, but as far as I know, the Babouches never enhanced any aspect of the Regen or the initial amount healed. All they did was add a Remedy effect to the oil.

As I said, my apology if I misunderstood and you didn't mean that they did.

Ok, that was another mistake on my part, it added an erase effect to repair.

I was meshing the effect with guignol for w/e reason. I'm still half asleep.

Some people give me so much headache in these threads.

I hope it's not me. I'm being extremely nit-picky today. ;.; Probably gonna stop posting now cause I know I'm just derailing the thread.

No problem, was just making sure I didn't miss something and no one was misled. x.x Some of the things I've had to teach out of new PUPs I've met while playing have been...ridiculous to say the least.

Nah, not you Spath-kun.

:D <3

You really must speak in RT once in a while. I miss some of your comments. :<

Ok ok now I'm seriously done derailing. XP

Any mob? nah have to level the playing field imho of course a drg from the bird camps says hi. Need to have enough hp to be worth fighting or the sams will one shot before the others have a chance to build tp parses lie all the time because of those nuances.

I think the 100+ turtles have enough hp to withstand a few ws. Also, don't think that to compare KKK to other weapons all DDs need to attack at same time. Can just be a compare of, for ex. Rag vs KKK, or something like that. Though I think the op is the one that have to clear this. All we can do about it is wonder what is the best way to, fairly, compare the dmg of two weapons without using spreadsheets

Doesn't matter what target you chose you'll still be comparing players and not weapons.

All tests have variance that can be accounted for pretty much including player A sucking lmao...

I mean that's why in the parse I posted earlier I removed the rest of the group, thus only giving information about a pup vs a target people are familiar with.

But it's already hard to account for that as it is and it only gets worse with the variables he's adding by saying things like this
To average out and remove variables like one DD getting more turtles on the low level spectrum compared to another or getting shafted with spam Defense boosts while another never sees a turtle use one would require a good 100+ turtles to be accurate since you're looking at them attacking completely different targets during the entire parse. Not to mention the time between each engage as you'd also want to time it as simply showing it based on how many turtles killed wouldn't yield accurate results since both would technically be doing about the same amount of damage each turtle given they should have similar amounts of hp.

There's just way too many variables the way you're trying to set it up and goes right back to Seha's point.

Its a basic state of fact that the longer duration of a test run vs a subject the variance is reduced its a basic statistical principle....

Yes, but the only way to honestly compare them, is to determine their damage output over a period time while also killing enough different targets to produce an unbiased average.

I don't see the point of this "test" that we're supposed to do. Are we trying to determine if pup can outparse a 2hander if he messes up enough? Yes it can. Is pup even to any job on short-end targets? Yes, but the higher it goes, the further the gap leaving pup behind for reasons already stated dozens of time.
What is there to "test"?

Well, iwas thinking both DDs on one turtle at the same time. That will rule out any additional buff turtle might get that will give an advantage over the other DD. Also, I never said the parser was gonna be based on how many mobs a DD kill over the other, is a dmg comparison, so, is just dmg vs. dmg under same circumstances. And of course it would need to be more than just a few turtles to effectively see a pattern of dmg.

Any decent parse calculating dps takes time into consideration pretty easily.. You cant determine anything in 5 minutes over a few hours yes you can then compare the dps of each party tossing out highs and lows really this sort of thing is done all time across industries to calculate tons of variable data.

http://wiki.stat.ucla.edu/socr/index.php/EBook

The OP just want to see comparison, that answer can only be given by him. We are just giving out ideas of what's a fair way to compare the dmg of two weapons.

My apologies I suppose I was probably over thinking more than anything. Lack of sleep is partly the culprit and the other is simply me being derpy me. I still agree with Seha on the comparing of players more-so than weapons though.

1. Grab a spreadsheet
2. Plug buffs, gear and targets
3. ???
4. Profit.

No need to hate on turtles.

I am personally not a fan of spreadsheets since I've seen that, is a very different thing something in paper than in practice. But If he just want to compare dmg, guess he can use them. Also, let ppl actually play the game to test stuff. Is how things were done and are supose to be done in my opinion.

If you want to know the comparison in theory the spreadsheet is good enough. In practice it depends on the players, from their knowledge of the job used to their attention and even internet performance! There's nothing else to it.

Yep yep I like to put it on paper and prove it in practice nothing wrong with that. Who verified the spreadsheet was correct???

The real thing tho is after I spend 400 mil and all that time will I be happy? I love my rag it does make me happy lol....