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[dev1063] Job Adjustments: Warrior
サーバ: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 211
By Odin.Almont 2011-12-23 17:59:15
Nah, they're too busy cutting themselves to notice the difference.
Odin.Sheelay said: These tears? Oh, something got in my eye Q_Q
Bone chips...?
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サーバ: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3193
By Fenrir.Skarwind 2011-12-23 18:05:54
Nah, they're too busy cutting themselves to notice the difference.
Odin.Sheelay said: These tears? Oh, something got in my eye Q_Q
Bone chips...?
Giant Femurs :'(
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サーバ: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2854
By Bismarck.Bloodbathboy 2011-12-23 18:49:06
Are WAR's that over powered?? I have had MNK's hang with me at times?? Maybe nerf MNK and any other job that hits hard. Also I have seen BLM's nuke to hard, gimp them . And don't get me started on PUP's and BLU. See where this is leading?? Square, stop Please.
Cerberus.Tikal
サーバ: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4945
By Cerberus.Tikal 2011-12-23 18:54:18
I see a slippery slope argument.
On another note: The children, dear god, think of the children!
サーバ: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2854
By Bismarck.Bloodbathboy 2011-12-23 18:56:03
Hopefully Tana gets a swift kick in the nuts for Xmas!!
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サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2011-12-23 19:18:16
Bismarck.Bloodbathboy said: »Are WAR's that over powered?? I have had MNK's hang with me at times?? Maybe nerf MNK and any other job that hits hard. Also I have seen BLM's nuke to hard, gimp them . And don't get me started on PUP's and BLU. See where this is leading?? Square, stop Please. hey now mnk is in this nerf w/ you guys, lol
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サーバ: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 211
By Odin.Almont 2011-12-23 19:42:09
Bismarck.Bloodbathboy said: »Hopefully Tana gets a swift kick in the nuts for Xmas!!
Isn't that type of thing listed under "additional services" at some Gentlemen's Clubs in Japan? I'd go in on a gift cert for one of those for him.
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Titan.Bomber
サーバ: Titan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 373
By Titan.Bomber 2011-12-23 23:52:58
Why is BL Bismarck.Bloodbathboy said: »Are WAR's that over powered?? I have had MNK's hang with me at times?? Maybe nerf MNK and any other job that hits hard. Also I have seen BLM's nuke to hard, gimp them . And don't get me started on PUP's and BLU. See where this is leading?? Square, stop Please. Now now leave BLM out of this lol cant get any worse than double weakness even tho SE did it cuz of the zombie rmt taru BLMs if they took it away 1 hour later they would put it back in XD zombie nuking w/ todays power would be tooo much
Gilgamesh.Hunewearl
サーバ: Gilgamesh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 167
By Gilgamesh.Hunewearl 2011-12-24 00:51:04
More than once, actually.
- 2 handed update has been nerfed after the buff. SAMs were poping 2k Gekkos on anything that existed in the game, people didn't like (poor Khimaira back then). Other jobs got nerfed too since it was a 2 handed update, but you get the point.
- Overwhelm lv 4 and 5 update.
- Empyrean WSs buffing other jobs more than SAM, leading to a nerf in term of general game balance.
I'm forgeting a lot of things (such as meditate nerf, back in the days) but every job has been nerfed at some point, either directly or indirectly.
Logic would tell you that any buff to X or Y job that isn't SAM and yet is a DD is a direct nerf to SAM since the job doesn't move and will be trashed in favor of another. This way, you can easily understand that crit WSs in Abyssea and an atma like RR was a big nerf toward SAM. Of course, the job was/is still used, but I have also seen many DRGs prior to Drakesbane being implemented/Penta Thrust being updated on HNMs. I think you understand where I'm getting at.
While I agree that nerfs aren't a nice thing (some people will remember the impact of the RNG nerf, for example), this announcement is not a nerf if you look at it from a "game scale" perspective. Actually, by doing so, they just buffed DRG, DRK, SAM, RNG and all other jobs whose purpose is to deal damage.
This is how balance work in a video game and while people like to ***on Tanaka because he's the "famous guy" so it's easier, he has obviously nothing to do in this update to begin with and this update actually brings more balance than anything else.
As someone posted above, WAR was parsing 80% over a SAM in Voidwatch. While I have no idea of the gear of both of them, I would assume that to throw out numbers like this on these forums, they have to be somewhat relevant players. If after that, you can still say that WAR was fine or that SAM was buffed way too much with Shoha (when it wasn't), I am really happy that you have 0 weight in what this game can become.
I agree that it's HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE, at 99, to pull out same numbers as we did at 75, or slightly better, when the enemies have evolved that much. They are actually buffing jobs little by little and this update was a joke next to what is planned to arrive in 2012, let's be real for a second. They just brought WAR and MNK back to the level they should have been at when Empyreans were released.
Bahamut.Danthebk
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 198
By Bahamut.Danthebk 2011-12-24 07:04:35
Gilgamesh.Hunewearl said: »
Logic would tell you that any buff to X or Y job that isn't SAM and yet is a DD is a direct nerf to SAM since the job doesn't move and will be trashed in favor of another.
No it wouldn't. Logic would tell me that an update that directly reduced SAM's previous ability would be a nerf. RR wasn't a SAM nerf, it was a buff for all DD jobs, some just benefited more than others. SAM might not have been a top contender for the DD spot anymore due to not having a critical hit weaponskill, but RR is still a buff to all DD jobs.
They're not buffing DRG|DRK|SAM, they're still going to do the same damage after this update, they might be more capable of out damaging a WAR now, but they're still just as good as they were previously, so they haven't been buffed.
While I do understand the point you're trying to make if you view a nerf as "any update that reduces a job's ability" where ability is linear across all (similar) jobs, then your statement would be true. But the ability of a DD job is semi-independent of other DD jobs.
Actually, this is a SAM nerf because they're debuffing blood rage as well, it just hurts critical weaponskill jobs more than SAM, but it is in fact lowering a SAM's ability while in a party with a WAR. Which is why DD's are only semi-independent rather than completely independent with the addition of Sphere effects, skillchains, AOE JAs, etc.
Sylph.Kimble
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2912
By Sylph.Kimble 2011-12-24 07:22:34
Gilgamesh.Hunewearl said: »More than once, actually.
- 2 handed update has been nerfed after the buff. SAMs were poping 2k Gekkos on anything that existed in the game, people didn't like (poor Khimaira back then). Other jobs got nerfed too since it was a 2 handed update, but you get the point.
- Overwhelm lv 4 and 5 update.
- Empyrean WSs buffing other jobs more than SAM, leading to a nerf in term of general game balance.
Im taking about SAM only nerfs, since ya know, the 2 handed nerf affected WAR, DRK, DRG as well. DRG was ripping ***apart to with pentra.
Overwhelm lv 4 and 5 were not a nerf, considering they were added that way. It wasnt 5% for both upgrades THEN lowered later.
You are really reaching with the Empy WS since Fodo was comparable to Katien so out of abyssea, it was an easy upgrade for SAM to get.
And no, nerfing a job isnt making others stronger. like someone said, you will still be doing the same damage as before so you are not stronger.
Bahamut.Atoreis
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 475
By Bahamut.Atoreis 2011-12-24 09:40:47
Thx everyone (mainly Taint and Ejiin and Zellc) that You realize me that Im QQing like a girl and that doesnt look good on Galka WAR :P. I went through it and I'am ok now. What doesn't kill you makes you stronger etc.
15/500(?)^^b
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Sylph.Kimble
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2912
By Sylph.Kimble 2011-12-24 09:47:41
why the (?)
Bahamut.Atoreis
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 475
By Bahamut.Atoreis 2011-12-24 12:38:13
Camate said: The below was stated in the December version update notes:
*New Magian trials for Relic, Mythic, and Empyrean weapons have been delayed to allow time for proper balancing.
They are scheduled to be introduced to the test server in the near future and implemented in the release version in an additional version update.
The items required for the trials, however, have been introduced in advance in this version update.
That being said, we are taking your feedback into consideration, but please do not make assumptions based on data that has not yet been finalized. As the trials are currently being checked for balance, there is a possibility that it will change.
I understand the desire to offer feedback using test server data, but until that data is finalized for testing, we would appreciate everyone waiting until there is more information available.
Sylph.Kimble
サーバ: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2912
By Sylph.Kimble 2011-12-24 12:45:42
Ah yeah, you're right. After they check for balance, you will need 5,000 for upgrade.
Bahamut.Atoreis
サーバ: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 475
By Bahamut.Atoreis 2011-12-24 12:49:11
Oh btw I was on marches yesterday and got amnesia a lot and I kinda felt like Im doing same/higher damage just swinging with AM3 instead of spaming WS. Is that possible?
Im pretty sure they will lower it to 200 empy and 100 mythic/relic which is still ridiculously high amount of PW and Arch dynamis lord.
I think only good solution if they would really want to leave Arch Dynamis Lord involved would be kill him 100times not get 100items from him. Few relics could advance at once that way and same for PW (If 5 ppl could each make one set a week then kill 5 at once it would be around 5 months which is not bad I guess)
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Cerberus.Taint
サーバ: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1514
By Cerberus.Taint 2011-12-24 17:29:57
Oh btw I was on marches yesterday and got amnesia a lot and I kinda felt like Im doing same/higher damage just swinging with AM3 instead of spaming WS. Is that possible? Im pretty sure they will lower it to 200 empy and 100 mythic/relic which is still ridiculously high amount of PW and Arch dynamis lord. I think only good solution if they would really want to leave Arch Dynamis Lord involved would be kill him 100times not get 100items from him. Few relics could advance at once that way and same for PW (If 5 ppl could each make one set a week then kill 5 at once it would be around 5 months which is not bad I guess)
He's back!
And it could be interesting after the update, with max haste and AM3 swinging. Back in the 93.3 days I would WS once and just swing since WS delay lowered my damage a ton.
Do we even know Arch DL drops the relic item? Haven't seen any confirmation at all.
サーバ: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2821
By Odin.Sheelay 2011-12-24 18:03:20
Oh btw I was on marches yesterday and got amnesia a lot and I kinda felt like Im doing same/higher damage just swinging with AM3 instead of spaming WS. Is that possible?
Im pretty sure they will lower it to 200 empy and 100 mythic/relic which is still ridiculously high amount of PW and Arch dynamis lord.
I think only good solution if they would really want to leave Arch Dynamis Lord involved would be kill him 100times not get 100items from him. Few relics could advance at once that way and same for PW (If 5 ppl could each make one set a week then kill 5 at once it would be around 5 months which is not bad I guess)
Agreed, requiring a set number of kills, rather than items off those NMs, would be much better. People from different groups could then team up like they did for the attestation NM kill trial.
サーバ: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1285
By Phoenix.Dramatica 2011-12-24 18:05:40
Yeah I don't know wtf they were thinking by making the final trial items. Going to be a huge bottleneck for any group with a lot of relics/mythics.
サーバ: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2821
By Odin.Sheelay 2011-12-24 18:09:53
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サーバ: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 211
By Odin.Almont 2011-12-24 21:05:57
Jesus H. Christ, if the final relic trial really is items that drop from Arch DL I guess I'm screwed. Thanks again, SE... Guess I should've just waited for the Empyreans to be implemented.
サーバ: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2854
By Bismarck.Bloodbathboy 2011-12-24 21:20:15
Yeah, my WAR for the most part out DD's anyone else in the party. But I am almost always the first to die and do so multiple times, lol. Ok wuss me out some. But give me more EVE and parring please. WAR stats suck on those skills. Give us something!! Come on Square!! It is Xmas!!
Asura.Dtroyy
サーバ: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 210
By Asura.Dtroyy 2011-12-24 21:24:29
Bismarck.Bloodbathboy said: »Yeah, my WAR for the most part out DD's anyone else in the party. But I am almost always the first to die and do so multiple times, lol. Ok wuss me out some. But give me more EVE and parring please. WAR stats suck on those skills. Give us something!! Come on Square!! It is Xmas!! You can have some more Eva and carry on not evading anything that matters
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Carbuncle.Xenhas
サーバ: Carbuncle
Game: FFXI
Posts: 664
By Carbuncle.Xenhas 2011-12-24 21:25:57
Bismarck.Bloodbathboy said: »Yeah, my WAR for the most part out DD's anyone else in the party. But I am almost always the first to die and do so multiple times, lol. Ok wuss me out some. But give me more EVE and parring please. WAR stats suck on those skills. Give us something!! Come on Square!! It is Xmas!!
use macros/temps
サーバ: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2854
By Bismarck.Bloodbathboy 2011-12-24 21:26:26
Yeah Dt, it is looking that way.
サーバ: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 211
By Odin.Almont 2011-12-24 21:26:46
Yeah, I'll pass on extra eva, but I'd love more parrying.
サーバ: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2854
By Bismarck.Bloodbathboy 2011-12-24 21:29:44
I will take anything, lol. Are WAR's getting anything besides the shaft.. I mean nerf guys??
サーバ: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 825
By Fenrir.Skadoosh 2011-12-24 21:29:53
Evasion?! Given that evasion checks before Retaliation, that could nerf one of our best abilities. I'll stick to -Evasion and hope my WHM doesn't suck.
サーバ: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1285
By Phoenix.Dramatica 2011-12-24 21:30:41
I would like absolutely nothing defensive added onto war, it's simply a glass cannon job.
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By Ariaum 2011-12-24 21:32:00
Phoenix.Dramatica said: »Yeah I don't know wtf they were thinking by making the final trial items. Going to be a huge bottleneck for any group with a lot of relics/mythics.
That's what they where thinking.....? lol
[dev1063] Job Adjustments: Warrior
* Warrior Job Adjustments
o Critical hit damage enhancement will be removed from the job ability “Blood Rage”
Previous effect: Enhances critical hit rate and critical hit damage for party members within area of effect.
New effect: Enhances critical hit rate for party members within area of effect.
o The TP critical hit rate bonus for the weapon skill Ukko’s Fury will be reduced.
*This is the same adjustment mentioned in [dev1064] Weapon Skill Adjusments.
*Adjustments and testing will be conducted in two phases.
* Phase one:
Balance adjustments (as above) introduced to test server, feedback collected.
* Phase two (introduction dependent on results of phase one testing):
Enhancement of job abilities Double Attack and Critical Attack Bonus.
Internal testing and balance adjustments to be followed by test server introduction and feedback collection.
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If you wish to discuss or submit feedback on this topic, please use the [dev1063] tag.
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